Buddhahood in Chan

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Astus
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Astus » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:00 am

Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



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Huifeng
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Huifeng » Sat Aug 27, 2011 11:04 am



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Malcolm
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:08 pm

Last edited by Malcolm on Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.




འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

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Malcolm
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:14 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

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Astus
Former staff member
Posts: 6615
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:22 pm
Location: Budapest

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Astus » Sat Aug 27, 2011 3:22 pm

"Which first bhumi?"

Only the usual ten bodhisattva stages are the bhumis, the others are faith, dwelling, conduct, transference, then the stages/bhumis.

"As I said, it is treated in the same way. When a bodhisattva realizes the first bhumi, there is no more emptiness to realize, all that is left to do is to complete the two accumulations, as I told you, the ten stages only map qualities, not realization."

As the quote said, there is no realisation on any of those bhumis. The realisation happened on the 11th level, the first level of dwelling, and the 1st bhumi is the 41st level.
Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



User avatar
Astus
Former staff member
Posts: 6615
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:22 pm
Location: Budapest

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Astus » Sat Aug 27, 2011 3:50 pm

"Since Chan, Huayen, and so on do not add any new insights into the nature of reality, nor do they add any revolutionary new methods, any claims they make to sudden buddhahood are merely rhetoric and philosophical trickery."

On one hand, Chan can be deduced from the sutras, so it is in no contradiction with the Buddha's teachings. On the other, the interpretation they make of the Dharma is unique in content, method and style. In content it teaches the sudden enlightenment that accomplishes buddhahood directly. In method it uses immediate insight into the true nature of mind. In style it has developed a language of enlightened action, most apparent in koans.
Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.



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Malcolm
Posts: 24173
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:55 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

deepbluehum
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Location: San Francisco, CA

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby deepbluehum » Sat Aug 27, 2011 5:39 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 5:49 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Jnana
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Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:58 pm

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Jnana » Sat Aug 27, 2011 7:43 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 7:49 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

deepbluehum
Posts: 1302
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 2:05 am
Location: San Francisco, CA

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby deepbluehum » Sat Aug 27, 2011 8:43 pm

I also just wanted to point out something I feel matters a great deal. There is no difference between what Chan and Vajrayana say emptiness is. Where the disputes arise is when either side posits what a buddha is and how it is attained. Namdrol is accurate in pointing out the key point is maintaining post-meditation equipoise. This is what merit is really about, to give up grasping altogether.

deepbluehum
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby deepbluehum » Sat Aug 27, 2011 8:52 pm


Jnana
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Jnana » Sat Aug 27, 2011 8:54 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:05 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Jnana
Posts: 1106
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:58 pm

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Jnana » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:15 pm


deepbluehum
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Location: San Francisco, CA

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby deepbluehum » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:21 pm


Jnana
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Jnana » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:38 pm


Jnana
Posts: 1106
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:58 pm

Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Jnana » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:44 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: Buddhahood in Chan

Postby Malcolm » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:59 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa


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