YOU CANNOT POST. OUR WEB HOSTING COMPANY DECIDED TO MOVE THE SERVER TO ANOTHER LOCATION. IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN VIEW THIS VERSION WHICH DOES NOT ALLOW POSTING AND WILL NOT SAVE ANYTHING YOU DO ONCE THE OTHER SERVER GOES ONLINE.

The value of nibbana - Dhamma Wheel

The value of nibbana

A forum for beginners and members of other Buddhist traditions to ask questions about Theravāda (The Way of the Elders). Responses require moderator approval before they are visible.
char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:41 am

Hi, I have this confusing thought in mind, could anyone please shed some light :smile:

If there is no "I" then how does nibbana matters more than suffering since there is no "one" to save?

Like it does not matter whethere there is a broken car or no car at all if there is no one to drive.

Paññāsikhara
Posts: 980
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 5:27 am
Contact:

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Paññāsikhara » Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:48 am

My recently moved Blog, containing some of my writings on the Buddha Dhamma, as well as a number of translations from classical Buddhist texts and modern authors, liturgy, etc.: .

User avatar
Goofaholix
Posts: 2928
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:49 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Goofaholix » Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:59 am


char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:05 am

I feel that myself as a being have an identity that separates myself from other being and that need to be preseved but nibbana does not seem as a way to preservation other than self-destruction so I am having a difficult time getting motivated towards nibbana. Probably I have too much kilesa to see nibbana as the way out.

char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:12 am


User avatar
Guy
Posts: 762
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 4:05 am
Location: Perth, Western Australia

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Guy » Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:16 am

Hi Char,

Nibbana is not destruction of self because there is no self to begin with. There is only the habitual tendency to grasp at a self. Usually one of the 5 khandhas (body, feelings, perceptions, mental formations, consciousness) is what we take to be a self or belonging to a self. When we see that all these things are impermanent then what is there that is worth grasping at or clinging to which we can safely identify as a self?

It is this grasping at a sense of self through the lack of knowledge that there is no self (and taking that which is impermanent to be permanent) which causes suffering.

With Metta,

Guy
Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:48 am


char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:52 am

Between this life and nibbana, it feels like having to choose between a rotten apple or no apple to me :?

User avatar
retrofuturist
Site Admin
Posts: 17855
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby retrofuturist » Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:56 am

Greetings char101,

If you really wish to investigate the subtleties of what nibbana is and isn't, I highly recommend...

Bhikkhu Nanananda's Nibbana Sermons
http://www.what-buddha-taught.net/Books ... rmon_8.htm

Nibbana is a tricky subject, and hard to do just to in a "Discovering Theravada" environment. Many seasoned campaigners have differing views on nibbana so giving a stock standard clear and succint Theravadin perspective that will be easily understood by the reader is not going to be an easy task.

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

User avatar
Guy
Posts: 762
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 4:05 am
Location: Perth, Western Australia

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Guy » Sun Feb 21, 2010 4:20 am

Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

Kenshou
Posts: 1030
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 12:03 am
Location: Minneapolis, MN

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Kenshou » Sun Feb 21, 2010 4:40 am


Reductor
Posts: 1381
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2009 6:52 am
Location: Alberta, Canada

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Reductor » Sun Feb 21, 2010 4:45 am


User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby jcsuperstar » Sun Feb 21, 2010 7:28 am

สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

User avatar
salmon
Posts: 169
Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:55 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby salmon » Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:02 am

~ swimming upstream is tough work! ~

User avatar
ground
Posts: 2591
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:01 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby ground » Mon Feb 22, 2010 6:08 am


User avatar
Goofaholix
Posts: 2928
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:49 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Goofaholix » Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:20 am


User avatar
Guy
Posts: 762
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 4:05 am
Location: Perth, Western Australia

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby Guy » Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:07 am

Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

rowyourboat
Posts: 1952
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:29 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby rowyourboat » Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:04 pm

in this type of situation I think it is better to look at the positive outcome of attaining nibbana, rather than debating the metaphysics. This is simply the ending of all forms of mental suffering brought on by whatever the world throws at us. The result is clarity, mindfulness, joy and peace. Surely that is worthwhile?
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Mon Feb 22, 2010 3:30 pm

Thanks for your opinions, I totally agree with them.

Probaly to restate my view: in buddhism, life is suffering and the freedom is nibbana, which is the stopping of sankhara. And since a being is essentially just sankara (mind and body), achieving nibbana also means the that there will be "nothing" left after the being (note that what I refers to a being is just a formation of body and mind and nothing else) dies.

Which renders life and existence as meaningless and the solution is essentially the annihilantion of it (note that I am not saying annihilation of self since there is no self to being with but annihilation of sankhara).

I am not arguing about nibbana as the way out of suffering, it just that the fact about life ( = suffering) and the fact about nibbana ( = end of suffering = end of sankhara = end of existence = nothing left) seems so... meaningless

char101
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 am

Re: The value of nibbana

Postby char101 » Mon Feb 22, 2010 3:47 pm



Return to “Discovering Theravāda”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine