There is a lot of talk about all yanas or all religions and ideologies being the same in books and conferences. But it's good deeds for harmony to benefit beings. When was a recent Zen rainbow body? Apart from the missing Vajrayana complete cycles for full enlightenment as well as the unique methods of Dzogchen and Mahamudra, no lineage of transmission of DI/PO: no comparison.
narraboth wrote:Khenpo Ngachung said that the 'power' and qualities of vajrayana led recognition is superior than sutrayana led one, base on his own experience, but still it's not two rigpa being recognised. I think it's just how 'revealed' the mind nature is.
Yes, after suffering and letting others one could have helped suffer too meanwhile and waiting for three incalculable eons or billions of years if not trillions with no guarrantees and possible falls during that long time anyway.
Strangely, Zen is probably a chinese buddhist school emphasis lineage the most. You can choose not to believe the story of 'Buddha holding a flower and smile' and all the line til Bodhidharma (actually there is a list of all lineage masters names from Buddha to him), but discredit a school with 'no lineage' probably is not that good. Like we say in Nyingma 'the lineage of realisation', correctly pointing out and examinating the realisation are also lineage, even if it's not in a Vajrayana way. (Lineage is not just a Vajrayana thing, not even just a mahayana thing. For Vinaya, you also need to have a lineage, and it simply is that you get vinaya vows from someone who has it. )
My suggestion is, don't one school is lower until you well study most of its doctrines, it's not a very good interdependence for dharma practioners. And don't judge what great masters said is only 'good deeds for harmony to benefit beings'. It could also be very true and sincerely said, couldn't it? If just for harmony, why those masters especially mentioned trekcho?
If you claim something strictly based on texts, like Namdrol did most of time, maybe it's ok. Don't guess base on your own thinking, it can be dangerous.
Not sure why you mention rainbow body in Zen, is that related to the topic? I don't remember any text saying a enlightened being who showed rainbow body is higher than other enlightened beings.
Another strange logic-linked comment: Khenpo Ngachung was not compairing the time of two methods, he was simply saying the emptiness recognitions are the same, but through the vajrayana methods, realisation can show more qualities, base on his experience.