Self-Indulgence

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Self-Indulgence

Postby LastLegend » Mon May 30, 2011 8:31 am

Whomsoever in this world
this base clinging thirst overcomes,
his sorrows flourish
like well-watered biira.na grass. -- 335


Whoso in the world overcomes this base unruly craving,
from him sorrows fall away
like water-drops from a lotus-leaf. -- 336


DHAMMAPADA
http://www.quangduc.com/kinhdien/231phapcutk24.html
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NAM MO A DI DA PHAT (VIETNAMESE)
NAMO AMITUOFO (CHINESE)
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby Sherab Dorje » Mon Jun 06, 2011 11:58 am

LastLegend wrote:
Whomsoever in this world
this base clinging thirst overcomes,
his sorrows flourish
like well-watered biira.na grass. -- 335


Whoso in the world overcomes this base unruly craving,
from him sorrows fall away
like water-drops from a lotus-leaf. -- 336


DHAMMAPADA
http://www.quangduc.com/kinhdien/231phapcutk24.html

Looks to me like 335 is wrongly translated!
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby LastLegend » Mon Jun 06, 2011 2:20 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:Looks to me like 335 is wrongly translated!
:namaste:


oh? what should be the accurate translation?
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby Sherab Dorje » Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:04 pm

I looked it up in a couple of other versions and the meaning should be that if they DO NOT overcome this base clinging thirst that their sorrows will flourish. Obviously this makes much more sense, since overcoming base clinging thirst should reduce suffering, right?! So correct syntax would be:
Whomsoever in this world
is overcome by this base clinging thirst,
his sorrows flourish
like well-watered biira.na grass
Now there is no (or little chance) of misinterpreting the contents. The other translation is slightly ambivalent. Just picking at nits! :tongue:
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby Paul » Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:42 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:
LastLegend wrote:
Whomsoever in this world
this base clinging thirst overcomes,
his sorrows flourish
like well-watered biira.na grass. -- 335


Whoso in the world overcomes this base unruly craving,
from him sorrows fall away
like water-drops from a lotus-leaf. -- 336


DHAMMAPADA
http://www.quangduc.com/kinhdien/231phapcutk24.html

Looks to me like 335 is wrongly translated!
:namaste:


It does make sense the way it's written, although it's pretty confusingly florid.
This nature of mind is spontaneously present.
That spontaneity I was told is the dakini aspect.
Recognizing this should help me
Not to be stuck with fear of being sued.

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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby Pema Rigdzin » Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:41 am

gregkavarnos wrote:I looked it up in a couple of other versions and the meaning should be that if they DO NOT overcome this base clinging thirst that their sorrows will flourish. Obviously this makes much more sense, since overcoming base clinging thirst should reduce suffering, right?! So correct syntax would be:
Whomsoever in this world
is overcome by this base clinging thirst,
his sorrows flourish
like well-watered biira.na grass
Now there is no (or little chance) of misinterpreting the contents. The other translation is slightly ambivalent. Just picking at nits! :tongue:
:namaste:


As it was originally written, it talks about the base clinging thirst overcoming such a person, so it makes grammatical sense. I think I do like your proposed wording better, though, for reasons of semantics.
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby KeithBC » Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:48 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:I looked it up in a couple of other versions and the meaning should be that if they DO NOT overcome this base clinging thirst that their sorrows will flourish. Obviously this makes much more sense, since overcoming base clinging thirst should reduce suffering, right?! So correct syntax would be:
Whomsoever in this world
is overcome by this base clinging thirst,
his sorrows flourish
like well-watered biira.na grass
Now there is no (or little chance) of misinterpreting the contents. The other translation is slightly ambivalent. Just picking at nits! :tongue:
:namaste:

It wasn't wrongly translated.

However, given the general decline in grammatical knowledge, especially knowledge of the distinction between the Nominative and Objective cases which is considered esoteric nowadays, your version does make it harder to misunderstand.

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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby Sherab Dorje » Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:06 am

KeithBC wrote:However, given the general decline in grammatical knowledge, especially knowledge of the distinction between the Nominative and Objective cases which is considered esoteric nowadays, your version does make it harder to misunderstand.
You know what KeithBC, I have post graduate qualifications (in social sciences) from one of the best Australian universities and I have no idea about grammatical knowledge. English grammer was never formally taught in the Australian primary and secondary school system when I was a kid (not in the state run educational system). I have no idea what a nominative and objective case is, but I have learnt how to structure sentences so that ambivalence is reduced to a minimum. I guess you studied english philology or literature?
:namaste:
PS Kindda off-topic I know!
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby PadmaVonSamba » Sat Jun 11, 2011 4:27 am

it helps if you understand that when you water the grass, the grass absorbs water it and this makes it spread, but by contrast, water poured on a lotus rolls off.

It's like comparing a sponge and a duck.
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Re: Self-Indulgence

Postby KeithBC » Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:34 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:I have no idea what a nominative and objective case is, but I have learnt how to structure sentences so that ambivalence is reduced to a minimum. I guess you studied english philology or literature?


No, I was a computer science major. But when I was in elementary school, it was known as grammar school because that's what they taught.

Nominative case: who is doing it. Objective case: whom it is being done to.

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