Dechen Norbu wrote:
Maybe Namdrol could clarify this.
It appears to me that our friend, adinatha, is a primarily a Kagyu practitioner.
I don't find his statements especially compatible with Dzogchen as I understand it and practice it.
But I also think that engaging in proofs and refutations using Dzogchen tantras is an abuse of the teachings.
You too far. You don't know what I am primarily. Whatever is reflecting in your mind is just bias and limitation. I'm not abusing anything. I'm making an effort to elucidate the inner meaning of Ati. I'm afraid your next move will be some sort of ostracism. With all due respect and deference to your seniority, powerful intellect, and deep scholarship, I request you not to go there, however, sir. Atiyoga tantras are well published, public and stand on their own. I'm just bringing them up.
My premise is that there is a profound inner meaning of effortlessness without paths or progression that underlies all three series of Dzogchen. I contend Guru Garab Dorje's Three Vajra Verses are definitive and simultaneous. I contend the meaning of Atiyoga is the extreme limit of all possible yoga, beyond any possibility of attaining or not, and beyond any stages. It is not instantaneous or gradual. It is beyond. It is primordial guru of inseparability.
Of course my approach does take time. If I am allowed to hang around, what I say can and will sink in for some. A give and take and a dialogue goes on. For others, there is your approach, which I do not sneeze at. I respect it profoundly. I don't see too many people here going into Togal retreat either. Few ever will. Think carefully about what you say. I won't abuse you. Please, do not abuse me. Just make your case. I'll make mine, and people will do what they see fit.
If you think there is some protocol I should follow, you should address me off list. Let's be professional. Public slashing is totally unnecessary. I simply won't stand for it.