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Talking to New Age/Western buddhists - Page 3 - Dhamma Wheel

Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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pink_trike
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby pink_trike » Wed Oct 28, 2009 5:57 am

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

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zavk
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby zavk » Thu Oct 29, 2009 4:57 am

With metta,
zavk

alan
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby alan » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:17 am

You must have put a lot of thought into that answer. Or at least time. So now I hope you will forgive me when I say I have no idea what you are talking about. Can you summarize it in, say, 10,000 words or less?

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pink_trike
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby pink_trike » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:24 am

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

alan
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Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:14 am
Location: Miramar beach, Fl.

Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby alan » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:30 am

Ok then how about 877 words, give or take a few hundred!

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Ben
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby Ben » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:39 am

As always, a great post, Zavk.
Selling spirituality looks like it'll go on the short list for my reading list.

The comment you quoted regarding the appropriation of Buddhism by the west (as the result of colonialisation), reminds me of a reported conversation a dhamma friend had about 20 years ago with a first-gen vietnamese or cambodian australian (Buddhist) who scornfully said to my dhamma-friend that the people in the west had no hope of understanding Buddhism. So it makes me wonder how much of Buddhism we have recrafted in our own image?
metta

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

alan
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby alan » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:51 am

How much of Buddhism have we "recrafted" in our own image?
Isn't that essential to my question?

alan
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby alan » Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:12 am

"Appropriation".
"As a result of colonization".
No, I don't think you really believe that!

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Ben
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby Ben » Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:33 am

What I believe, alan, is irrelevent.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

alan
Posts: 2812
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:14 am
Location: Miramar beach, Fl.

Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby alan » Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:35 am

Why, Friend?

Individual
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby Individual » Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:27 am

Zavk's long post about is sensible and insightful.
The best things in life aren't things.


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A Medic
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby A Medic » Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:00 pm


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zavk
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby zavk » Tue Nov 03, 2009 10:27 pm

With metta,
zavk

alan
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby alan » Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:10 am

Succinct and right to the point. Excellent. I'll put that book on the top of my reading list.
Thanks.

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zavk
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby zavk » Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:32 am

Hi Alan

I am, in fact, reading the book now--you are referring to The Making of Buddhist Modernism right? I'm really, really enjoying it. It is based on scholarly research but the writing is clear and non-jargonistic. The book really opens up ways of thinking about such recurring questions as: 'Did Buddhism really predate modern science? Do we really have access to a 'pristine' Buddhism?'

You could sample the Introduction chapter on Google Books before deciding to buy it or not: http://books.google.com.au/books?id=XU6 ... q=&f=false

There is a review of the book in the Journal of Global Buddhism: http://www.globalbuddhism.org/10/schedneck09.pdf

Anyway, I prefer to get my books from http://www.bookdepository.co.uk these days. It has free worldwide delivery. Books usually cost a few dollars more than Amazon but shipping is free and pretty quick too.
With metta,
zavk

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christopher:::
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby christopher::: » Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:57 am

"As Buddhists, we should aim to develop relationships that are not predominated by grasping and clinging. Our relationships should be characterised by the brahmaviharas of metta (loving kindness), mudita (sympathetic joy), karuna (compassion), and upekkha (equanimity)."
~post by Ben, Jul 02, 2009

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James N. Dawson
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby James N. Dawson » Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:28 am

Alan,

At one time I think I felt like you about this. I felt a need to challenge those with a New Age approach to Buddhism. But as time went on, I realized that trying to do so only brought conflict and ill feeling. I also realized how much further I had to walk on the path, how enormous was my own task in learning, understanding and following the Dhamma, and purifying my own mind. The New Agers, I suppose, are doing their best, even though you and I might see their understanding as less than Dhamma.

Rather than struggle with the New Agers, you just have to find people who understand and support you on the path you believe is true. Until then, you may just have to walk alone, and be an island unto yourself.

Not to imply it was just a bunch of nonsense, but I didn't understand zvak's long post very well either. Maybe a little. But as I said in my intro, I'm slow.

James

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Cittasanto
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby Cittasanto » Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:03 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

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Cittasanto
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Re: Talking to New Age/Western buddhists

Postby Cittasanto » Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:26 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.


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