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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:02 am 
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KwanSeum wrote:
I think there is no such thing as 'western culture' espically in this age of multiculturalism.

I guess you could say that the West is a subculture of the multiculture. :tongue:


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:06 am 
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Heruka wrote:
This deviation takes a group or behavior to be segregated from the norms.




the other side here is social norms, or realitive morality. social means a group or a society. society has norms and morality, reward and punishments. in other words control.

is "buddhism" a society? if so, its export from the east to the west must either change the society, or have influence upon, i.e. exert control.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:07 am 
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mindyourmind wrote:
You have some interesting ideas about what constitutes a polite and interesting discussion. Maybe your take on "sleepy" and "foggy" comes from people not agreeing with you? Or you not being able to convey your thoughts and ideas clearly?


we are playing a game.

a thought experiment.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:14 am 
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btw, my style is cryptic at times, i agree, this is because i dont wish to offer the answer, but more interested in what you think.


my favorite clockwork orange quote.

Quote:
thinking is for the gloopy ones
what i vidded was what the lumi got,
like inspiration and what bog sends and stuff.
lol


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:29 am 
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Rael wrote:
Art is everything.
counter culture is art...
without counter culture everything stagnates.

the classics remain classic...
we realize our classic view is obviously superior when counter culture dictates....


interesting.

would like it if you could expand on this.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:34 am 
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Heruka wrote:
my favorite clockwork orange quote.

Quote:
thinking is for the gloopy ones
what i vidded was what the lumi got,
like inspiration and what bog sends and stuff.
lol




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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 6:39 am 
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Heruka wrote:
Rael wrote:
Art is everything.
counter culture is art...
without counter culture everything stagnates.

the classics remain classic...
we realize our classic view is obviously superior when counter culture dictates....


interesting.

would like it if you could expand on this.

it was just i your humble narrator .....
it was meant for helping like...

i type at night , you know helping like....

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 8:01 pm 
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Rael wrote:
would like it if you could expand on this
it was just i your humble narrator .....
it was meant for helping like...

i type at night , you know helping like....


righty right then!


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 10:40 pm 
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shel wrote:
KwanSeum wrote:
I think there is no such thing as 'western culture' espically in this age of multiculturalism.

I guess you could say that the West is a subculture of the multiculture. :tongue:


the point is culture is given to you.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 10:51 pm 
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the clockwork orange reference was on the surface, whimsical, but actually no. In art, one trains to actually see, and not merely look. Culture is handed down to you with the intention that you will simply look and not actually see. The man behind the curtain likes to remain there and is banking on you not actually pulling the curtain back to see. The movie scene is showing you everything, all you need is the keys to see. Buddhist religion is just another extension of control, it has its patriarchs, its priest caste, its power structure, it tells you with word magic that you are born impure, and only through the power structure can you be made pure.

it is no more different than a thousand years ago, the village witch doctor throwing a hand full of sulphur into a fire to have it spark and spit, to captivate the ignorant you into the belief that he has the power of the gods.

freedom is not granted to you by another.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:20 am 
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So what is your definition of freedom?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:43 am 
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justsit wrote:
So what is your definition of freedom?


riding naked on a horse on the open grass plains, with the sun on my back and only lunch on my mind.

:tongue:

anything else is just a confidence of the snake oil salesman!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:33 am 
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So you've finally revealed the true purpose of this thread:
You're outing yourself as a nihilist?

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Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:42 am 
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Adamantine wrote:
So you've finally revealed the true purpose of this thread:
You're outing yourself as a nihilist?

Selflessness, not to have to so, or so is nihilism? A tree, without being called christmas tree and the need for traditional lamps and little bears on it. and other rules, cultural and so on.

Okay, I don't understand. Maybe in fabrications (about so and so and...) is no peace. In equality of appearance and emptiness is peace (wisdom).

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:43 pm 
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Heruka wrote:
justsit wrote:
So what is your definition of freedom?


riding naked on a horse on the open grass plains, with the sun on my back and only lunch on my mind.

:tongue:

anything else is just a confidence of the snake oil salesman!


Tried that. Got saddle sores, sunburned, and the horse went lame.
No freedom there.

So why bother posting on Dharmawheel?
Indeed, why bother with Dharma?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:20 pm 
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No way to express if figurative is taken for real.
here some words of Dzongzar Khyyentse Rinpoche: " We should have the courage to go beyond norms and not get stuck in usual boundaries, but go beyond those logics.
If we can see the compounded habits, we can cut through them.

"One doesn't become a follower of the Buddha by rituals or disciplines like vegetarian or wearing ropes, incense and flowers, Tibetan sand mandalas and Japanese Zen garden."

Four seals are like tea while all means to actualize; practices, rituals, traditions and all cultural traps are cups. Skills and method are observable, truth not. The challenge is not be be taken away by the cup".

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:45 pm 
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This as well: "now that Buddhism is flourishing in the west, people altering teachings to fit in the modern way of thinking. Rituals and symbols are to be adapt, not the truth itself.

Buddha said that his discipline and methods should be adapted appropiately to time and place but the four truths don't need to be updated or modified! You can change the compounded impermanent cup, but the tea remains pure.

The truths are not social or cultural exceptions".

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:59 pm 
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Heruka wrote:
the clockwork orange reference was on the surface, whimsical, but actually no. In art, one trains to actually see, and not merely look. Culture is handed down to you with the intention that you will simply look and not actually see. The man behind the curtain likes to remain there and is banking on you not actually pulling the curtain back to see. The movie scene is showing you everything, all you need is the keys to see. Buddhist religion is just another extension of control, it has its patriarchs, its priest caste, its power structure, it tells you with word magic that you are born impure, and only through the power structure can you be made pure.

it is no more different than a thousand years ago, the village witch doctor throwing a hand full of sulphur into a fire to have it spark and spit, to captivate the ignorant you into the belief that he has the power of the gods.

freedom is not granted to you by another.


for me it's like the Carney peek behind the scenes...

you realize the Carney's all look at anyone outside as marks...
Everything is geared to relieve you of money....

But I think you seeing that in the Buddhist tradition is a little harsh...

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