Chaz wrote:manjughoṣamaṇi wrote:Suit yourself. I have just never heard of Pāḷi material making up part of a Vajrayāna curriculum before. I have no beef with it.
Well some say that you can't understand the Vajrayana without and understanding of Mahayana and you can't understand Mahayana without understanding Hinayana.
I would be one of those people.
A student myst start somewhere and the best place to start is at the beginning - 4 Noble Truths, Eightfold Path, Dependant Origination and so on. My teachers recognize this. I couldn't start my Mahayana studies until I had completed my Hinayana course work. That means Vajrayana study and practice would not have been possible, either.
I understand this. Though there are differences in when it is considered suitable to introduce a student to the practices and study of a specific yāna, I don't know any teachers or Vajrayāna who don't believe that you need to have at least an understanding of the essential points of all 3 yānas.
However, the Pāḷi Canon is not the only place these teachings are found. There were many śrāvaka schools and subschools (the number and names vary depending on the sources). Each of these schools had their respective recensions of the suttas/āgamas and vinaya. There are translations of some (not many) śrāvaka sūtras in the Tibetan Canon. For example, the quote in my signature is from the Tibetan translation of the Sanskrit Maitribhāvana Sūtra which is analagous to the Pāḷi Mettabhāvana Sutta. Generally in the Tibetan traditions the śrāvaka teachings studied are from 2 subschools of the Sarvāstivāda tradition, the Vaibhāśikas and the Sautrāntikas. This is usually done formally by studying the Abhidharmakośabhāṣya and various commentaries on this text.
This is why I was curious which Pāḷi texts are being studied. Suttas? Abhidhamma? As I said, I have no problem with the inclusion of these texts into a curriculum, I am just curious which texts are used and what role they play. Personally, given the paucity of śrāvaka sūtras in the Tibetan Canon, and the lack of English translations of those that are, makes the Pālị suttas that are translated very useful. I think everyone should read Bhikku Bodhi's book, In the Buddha's Words, and his translation of the Saṃyutta Nikāya.
Even in the Vajrayana you'll find references. The Four Reminders practice as found in Ngondro is based on principles of renunciation found in the Hinayana teachings.
Yes. The question is, the Hinayāna teachings of which school?
Wishing you all the best.