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masturbation what's wrong? - Page 10 - Dhamma Wheel

masturbation what's wrong?

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tiltbillings
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Aug 27, 2009 7:09 pm


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby kc2dpt » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:08 am

- Peter


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby christopher::: » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:25 am

It's pretty clear, i think, that the Buddha taught that sensual desires are an obstacle to liberation and peace. That would include lust in any form, whether "acted" upon or not.

From what i know of psychology certain desires and experiences are by nature quite powerful and for lack of a better word potentially "addictive"... Desires for food, sex and alcohol would all fit into that category.

That doesn't mean these desires are "wrong"... we need food. Also air and water. Some of the others though - especially sex and alcohol - can create difficulties. It may depend on the person though, on how much of an obstacle each desire will be. One person can have a glass of wine every Friday evening and be fine, another masterbates or has sexual experiences once a week and is fine.

You have to watch your own mind very carefully to judge that, to observe the effect these actions are having. But Buddha was pretty clear, I think, that if you want to go the full distance, do your best to drop these habits, they are obstacles on the path.

Just my 2 cents.

:heart:
"As Buddhists, we should aim to develop relationships that are not predominated by grasping and clinging. Our relationships should be characterised by the brahmaviharas of metta (loving kindness), mudita (sympathetic joy), karuna (compassion), and upekkha (equanimity)."
~post by Ben, Jul 02, 2009

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Ben » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:34 am

Thanks Peter for refocusing the topic.

I'm one person who believes that masturbation falls into a category of akusala action that is, say, more akusala than some other forms of self-pleasure. While I don't think the Buddha addressed the issue in explicit detail, I think we can infer the morality of masturbation through what he taught us in relation to the danger inherent in indulging in sensory desires, and the operation of sankharas. I don't think its a huge deductive leap. I'm sorry I don't have any references to support my contention. I'm currently at work and about to finish my break.
Kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby christopher::: » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:38 am

"As Buddhists, we should aim to develop relationships that are not predominated by grasping and clinging. Our relationships should be characterised by the brahmaviharas of metta (loving kindness), mudita (sympathetic joy), karuna (compassion), and upekkha (equanimity)."
~post by Ben, Jul 02, 2009

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Guy » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:50 am

Four types of letting go:

1) Giving; expecting nothing back in return
2) Throwing things away
3) Contentment; wanting to be here, not wanting to be anywhere else
4) "Teflon Mind"; having a mind which doesn't accumulate things

- Ajahn Brahm

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby kc2dpt » Fri Aug 28, 2009 3:02 am

- Peter


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:42 am


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:50 am


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:29 am

Greetings,

Somewhere in the suttas, there's a quote made by the Buddha to the effect that one cannot partake in sensual pleasures, without being defiled by them. It was stated with reference to someone who genuinely believed sensual pleasures were not actually a hindrance. Apologies I can't find the source at the moment - hopefully someone will recognise it.

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:46 am


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby christopher::: » Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:47 am

"As Buddhists, we should aim to develop relationships that are not predominated by grasping and clinging. Our relationships should be characterised by the brahmaviharas of metta (loving kindness), mudita (sympathetic joy), karuna (compassion), and upekkha (equanimity)."
~post by Ben, Jul 02, 2009

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:54 am

That's the one - thanks Tilt.

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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tiltbillings
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:11 am


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:14 am


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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Fede » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:34 am

is 'grip' the operative word here?

It might, in all seriousness, well be.....

If we cease to be so 'intense' and loosen our grip on desire for sensual satisfaction, then the release is far greater, isn't it?
"Samsara: The human condition's heartbreaking inability to sustain contentment." Elizabeth Gilbert, 'Eat, Pray, Love'.

Simplify: 17 into 1 WILL go: Mindfulness!

Quieta movere magna merces videbatur. (Sallust, c.86-c.35 BC)
Translation: Just to stir things up seemed a good reward in itself. ;)

I am sooooo happy - How on earth could I be otherwise?! :D


http://www.armchairadvice.co.uk/relationships/forum/

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby christopher::: » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:38 am

"As Buddhists, we should aim to develop relationships that are not predominated by grasping and clinging. Our relationships should be characterised by the brahmaviharas of metta (loving kindness), mudita (sympathetic joy), karuna (compassion), and upekkha (equanimity)."
~post by Ben, Jul 02, 2009

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby christopher::: » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:39 am

"As Buddhists, we should aim to develop relationships that are not predominated by grasping and clinging. Our relationships should be characterised by the brahmaviharas of metta (loving kindness), mudita (sympathetic joy), karuna (compassion), and upekkha (equanimity)."
~post by Ben, Jul 02, 2009

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tiltbillings
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:39 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:54 am



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