Through purified mind is there compassion.

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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:34 am

Excuses are endless as fear, hope and desire.

An addicted would always try to involve others to get also addicted, as he does not see the danger in it. When he starts to realize that he is actually addicted, the first step is that he abstain from involving other. And one day he might overcome his addiction.
There are addicted, who change just the object of addiction. They wouldn't know.
Just that! :-)
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Fri Feb 18, 2011 5:17 am

Ohhh, and regarding the rats. They are not that dirty any more, as they have a lot of fresh organic wast every day. Yes some children had stopped to kill them as they where used to do when the rats run from one basked to the other searching for food, some children already enjoy to watch them on there feeding place and some also started to play. Most of the children used to eat those "big mouses" in there villages and had stopped to do so in the city because they are so dirty. Now most of them wouldn't like to kill one even it is a delicious food, still an issue for stories, memories of there earlier times.
Just that! :-)
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby ground » Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:29 am

There is also compassion based on thought and if one dwells concentrated "in" the effect of such thought the mind becomes purified through concentration. So this is the other way round. It is called "cultivation" which is wholesome, i.e. conducive for the path.


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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:26 am

Is that possible without abstain from unwholesome deeds?
Questioning in an other way, does action, speech and thoughts need to go hand in hand? For sure, all is originated in thought, but I would like to remember on the recycling way. Cleaning, dirty again, cleaning, dirty again... doesn't makes it sense to reduce the new dirt first?
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby White Lotus » Fri Feb 18, 2011 5:35 pm

The nameless is not as pure as true loving kindness. true loving kindness is purer than the nameless. the nameless leaves you with no within, no subject and is very pure. true loving kindness is purer even than the subjectless and i would recommend anyone who has reached that state to become one with true loving kindness and a return to perception of a subject.

love, White Lotus. x
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Ngawang Drolma » Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:15 pm

Hanzze wrote:Dear friends,

and what is active compassion and what keeps pity alive?


Pity is the near enemy of hatred while compassion is loving kindness.

Best,
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby ground » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:53 am

Hanzze wrote:Is that possible without abstain from unwholesome deeds?
Questioning in an other way, does action, speech and thoughts need to go hand in hand? For sure, all is originated in thought, but I would like to remember on the recycling way. Cleaning, dirty again, cleaning, dirty again... doesn't makes it sense to reduce the new dirt first?


Obviously you do not understand the way mind is purified. It is not "first this" and "then that". It is exacty how the Buddha taught: Cultivate wholesome states of mind and thereby remove what is a hindrance.
With the cultivation of wholesome states you temporarily remove what is a hindrance and with this temporary removal you prepare the basis for complete elimination of hindrances. Complete elimination can only take place when hindrances are not present because when they are present all that is good, any progress is blocked.
The compassion that is cultivated through applied thought conjoined with concentrative meditation is a simile of what will result "in the end". Neither completely identical, nor completely different. It is a familiarization with the removal of hindrances and the generation of a positive quality. It causes the experience: When there is this, that is not there.
It is the manifestation of right effort: Cultivate the positive and counteract the negative.

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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby muni » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:18 am

Thank you Mingyur and all.

Looking to compassion by the four immeasurable, how can compassion be a merely emotion which bind us? In the oceanlike activities of the Bodhisattva is no subject or object and empty altruism only.

With cultivation is me said, is there always the base of mindfulness in which no course thoughts abides and eventually upcoming obscuring emotions (merely natural empty energies) cannot burn our being when we recognize them or know how to undo those. Like desire is undone by meditation on the aspects of the object, hatred by loving kindness, jealousy by rejoice and so on. Many methods, many helpful finger- pointings to undo such suffering.

It is said when one has Bodhichitta, all that one does, even neutral actions, all turn into virtue and one will never stray from the path of total liberation.
It is not merely an emotion but I should express it a warm energy reinforcing our insight of how all is (emptiness) which is opening for all the door of freedom.
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:23 am

Ngawang Drolma wrote: while compassion is loving kindness.

Are you sure Ngawang Drolma. What do you think about what White rose wrote?
But maybe it is just about words.
Isn't the center of the magic three angle (let me call them the tools of purification) the "point" (loving kindness, or just kindness) to reach.
Just that! :-)
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:23 am

TMingyur wrote:
Hanzze wrote:Is that possible without abstain from unwholesome deeds?
Questioning in an other way, does action, speech and thoughts need to go hand in hand? For sure, all is originated in thought, but I would like to remember on the recycling way. Cleaning, dirty again, cleaning, dirty again... doesn't makes it sense to reduce the new dirt first?


Obviously you do not understand the way mind is purified. It is not "first this" and "then that". It is exacty how the Buddha taught: Cultivate wholesome states of mind and thereby remove what is a hindrance.
With the cultivation of wholesome states you temporarily remove what is a hindrance and with this temporary removal you prepare the basis for complete elimination of hindrances. Complete elimination can only take place when hindrances are not present because when they are present all that is good, any progress is blocked.
The compassion that is cultivated through applied thought conjoined with concentrative meditation is a simile of what will result "in the end". Neither completely identical, nor completely different. It is a familiarization with the removal of hindrances and the generation of a positive quality. It causes the experience: When there is this, that is not there.
It is the manifestation of right effort: Cultivate the positive and counteract the negative.

Kind regards

One might not have a fear/hindrence to purify the mind, even on and on. I guess one can develop it endless without realizing that he is growing to a recycling tycoon. Don't you think that this could happen if purification is not done in a natural way. A kind of "wrong" effort as we might do not know what is positive and what negative.
What grows a Bodhisattva and what a recycling tycoon?
Just that! :-)
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby muni » Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:03 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSbA5vj2 ... re=related

If one has genuine compassion with insight, one sees all appaerances and so our fellows( "we" arent' without our dependency with eachother) in the nature as all appaers, as all is. Practices are leading to this, or opening in right perception. Then compassion streams spontaneous in order to help. So is me told.
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby ground » Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:16 pm

Hanzze wrote:One might not have .... I guess one can develop it endless ... ... Don't you think that ...

How about practice instructions taught by kind teachers and rely one's experience?

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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:24 pm

TMingyur wrote:
Hanzze wrote:One might not have .... I guess one can develop it endless ... ... Don't you think that ...

How about practice instructions taught by kind teachers and rely one's experience?
Kind regards

That is indeed a hint.
Just that! :-)
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby White Lotus » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:41 pm

love without kindness is not true love. love without kindness can at times be selfish and no different from hate. the base of the triangle is love : hate. the apex of the triangle (true love) is loving kindness. there must be kindness : compassion.

yes Muni... a warm energy that radiates in the world of our awareness... beautiful. i know it too! even now sitting at my computer.

yes, loving kindness. possibly the ultimate. but too ignorant to know!

love, White Lotus.
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.
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Re: Through purified mind is there compassion.

Postby Hanzze » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:48 pm

Dear White Lotus,

kindness with love can at times be selfish and no different from greed.
Just that! :-)
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