Memorial/Passing Forum

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Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby kirtu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 3:41 am

We probably need a memorial/death announcement forum in order to announce deaths and to memorialize people.

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Virgo » Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:00 am

We probably need a memorial/death announcement forum in order to announce deaths and to memorialize people.

Kirt

A tamasic forum of death? Is it really the best idea?

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby kirtu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:11 am

Virgo wrote:
We probably need a memorial/death announcement forum in order to announce deaths and to memorialize people.

Kirt

A tamasic forum of death? Is it really the best idea?

Kevin


Do you object to obituaries? In the best cases these are celebrations of parinirvana.

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Ayu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:29 am

To get informed about the death of users is not "tamasic" - it is "sattvic" (sentient).
(Ah, i missed the joke, didn't I ?)
Anyhow it is a very good idea, also because one gets the opportunity to do prayers just in time. I was informed of the death of a very dear member in another forum about one year later. This was a bad feeling. I thought, this internet is much too anonymus.
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Sherab Dorje » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:19 am

Virgo wrote:
We probably need a memorial/death announcement forum in order to announce deaths and to memorialize people.

Kirt

A tamasic forum of death? Is it really the best idea?

Kevin
I am just going to ignore the "tamasic" bit (not having a clue what you are talking about) and ask you: why would it be a bad idea?
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Simon E. » Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:09 pm

Kevin is referencing the three Gunas of Samykha philosophy.
Sattva is balance and harmony.
Rajas is arousing and active.
Tamas is the quality of inertia and darkness, but why that should apply to Memorials of the dead escapes me.
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Ayu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:19 pm

Simon E. wrote:...
Tamas is the quality of inertia and darkness, but why that should apply to Memorials of the dead escapes me.

Sounds like a joke?

I know the term "tamasic" is used for "black" food (which for example should not be taken befor an initiation), like meat, fish, onion, alcohol... Also the passions like greed, hatred, anger, envy can be called tamasic, or baleful acts.

So i guess it was a joke and the ;) is missing.
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Adamantine » Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:29 pm

Ayu wrote: I was informed of the death of a very dear member in another forum about one year later. This was a bad feeling. I thought, this internet is much too anonymus.


YEs.. I agree, but in the case of members here I wonder how we would be informed of anyone's passing if they are anonymous. . . I guess usually some members know each other in real time though. . .
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Simon E. » Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:50 pm

Ayu wrote:
Simon E. wrote:...
Tamas is the quality of inertia and darkness, but why that should apply to Memorials of the dead escapes me.

Sounds like a joke?

I know the term "tamasic" is used for "black" food (which for example should not be taken befor an initiation), like meat, fish, onion, alcohol... Also the passions like greed, hatred, anger, envy can be called tamasic, or baleful acts.

So i guess it was a joke and the ;) is missing.

I am sure Kevin will inform us... :smile:
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Sönam » Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:34 pm

I thought we were speaking of passing of masters, teachers and so on ... but why not us also (I'll tell you when it will happen to me)

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby kirtu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 3:20 pm

Sönam wrote:I thought we were speaking of passing of masters, teachers and so on ... but why not us also (I'll tell you when it will happen to me)

Sönam


Everyone, but most of the postings in this vein have been masters and teachers, etc. Just right now they are scattered over different forums.

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Virgo » Wed Jan 22, 2014 3:27 pm

Simon E. wrote:I am sure Kevin will inform us... :smile:

Thank you Simon; I was referencing the three gunas.

I just think it is sort of a bad energy to have a specific forum just for dead masters and/or practitioners. It will start off slow with just one, and then posters who stay here for a long time will slowly see it grow over time. It can lead to thoughts of the forum slowly filling up, full of the names of the dead, to thoughts that all good masters are going to die, it will be another fresh reminder to students of a master who has died every time they see their masters name there, etc. Also, for a sub-forum it creates a kind of stuck-energy which is very tamasic for a number of reasons.

I feel it would be better to simply have a separate thread in 'announcements' each time. But it is certainly not up to me.

Don't let me stop you from having your forum. I am just warning you that is overall a tamasic thing. By extension, it adds a tamasic vibration to the board in general.

All the best,


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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Sherab Dorje » Wed Jan 22, 2014 3:50 pm

Virgo wrote:I just think it is sort of a bad energy to have a specific forum just for dead masters and/or practitioners. It will start off slow with just one, and then posters who stay here for a long time will slowly see it grow over time. It can lead to thoughts of the forum slowly filling up, full of the names of the dead, to thoughts that all good masters are going to die, it will be another fresh reminder to students of a master who has died every time they see their masters name there, etc. Also, for a sub-forum it creates a kind of stuck-energy which is very tamasic for a number of reasons.
It can also be a damn fine lesson in impermanence. A stark reminder for the need to practice diligently while we still have this precious human existence. A method to assist in not forgetting the dead and their contributions (ie reminding us of the dependently arisen nature of phenomena). Etc...

Yogis practiced in charnel grounds surrounded by the rotting remains of sentient beings.

The Siddha Kankaripa saw the true nature of phenomena by meditating on his beloved wife's corpse.
My Dakini-woman, my queen, my lady!
The visible form of my pure awareness,
Form not separate from me, nor yet a part of me,
The phenomenal appearance of empty space:
She is beyond compare and beyond words.


The Kapali Siddha Kapalapa meditated on the corpses of his wife and 5 sons that had died of a plague. He made his bone ornaments from his sons bones and his kapala from his wife's skull.

Etc...

So much for Samkhya notions of "bad vibes dude".
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Virgo » Wed Jan 22, 2014 3:59 pm

Sherab Dorje wrote:
Virgo wrote:I just think it is sort of a bad energy to have a specific forum just for dead masters and/or practitioners. It will start off slow with just one, and then posters who stay here for a long time will slowly see it grow over time. It can lead to thoughts of the forum slowly filling up, full of the names of the dead, to thoughts that all good masters are going to die, it will be another fresh reminder to students of a master who has died every time they see their masters name there, etc. Also, for a sub-forum it creates a kind of stuck-energy which is very tamasic for a number of reasons.
It can also be a damn fine lesson in impermanence. A stark reminder for the need to practice diligently while we still have this precious human existence. A method to assist in not forgetting the dead and their contributions (ie reminding us of the dependently arisen nature of phenomena). Etc...

Yogis practiced in charnel grounds surrounded by the rotting remains of sentient beings.

The Siddha Kankaripa saw the true nature of phenomena by meditating on his beloved wife's corpse.

Oh trust me, I am aware of death and have been around it my whole life. Our stomping grounds as teens were cemeteries, and I can assure you I spent much more time in large cemeteries than anyone here has over their life while I was growing up, unless you happen to work in one perhaps.

I also meditate on death and am aware of it's importance.

I am not saying we shouldn't let people die! All I am saying is that the thoughts and feeelings associated with those happening from people on the board who read or write those posts get's sort of petrified and stabilised by creating a specific forum for this. The energy cycles, recyclyes, much better and sort of washes out when it is in a more free-flowing forum like the announcements section.

I am a feng shui practitioner so I notice this kind of stuff.

Here is a nice article on the three gunas:
http://www.vedanet.com/2012/06/the-three-gunas-how-to-balance-your-consciousness/

It's Vedic, so you should show it some respect whether you agree with it or not, regardless if you want the forum or not.

All the best,

Kevin
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby kirtu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:24 pm

Virgo/Kevin, most Chinese temples I have been to have memorial walls or halls much like mausoleums in some cases. It's true that in some cases these places have what people might experience as negative energy. In other places, memorials are spread out throughout the temple grounds. This does not have the same feeling and is basically bright and uplifting.

I don't think a forum specifically for passing announcements and memorials will garner negative energy because often people add lineage prayers, images, mantras, etc. Also, I don't think this will happen in general. And as you know, contemplation of impermanence and death is very important. Most of the people very close to me in this life have left, beginning with my Grandfather at a young age (actually beginning before that but the experience did not stay with me). Now two of my main teachers from two different lineages have left and one teacher is quite ill. So I think this is quite important. Although we could leave it as it is now too.

However I had a close family member who encountered death personally as a young boy and was horrified. He never overcame this experience and IMO it hampered him spiritually his entire life. So some people will indeed have strong negative reactions (not implying that you are experiencing this).

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Ayu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:27 pm

To let people know that somebody died is not tamasic.
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby Ayu » Wed Jan 22, 2014 6:14 pm

Virgo wrote:...
I am not saying we shouldn't let people die! All I am saying is that the thoughts and feeelings associated with those happening from people on the board who read or write those posts get's sort of petrified and stabilised by creating a specific forum for this. The energy cycles, recyclyes, much better and sort of washes out when it is in a more free-flowing forum like the announcements section.

I am a feng shui practitioner so I notice this kind of stuff.

Here is a nice article on the three gunas:
http://www.vedanet.com/2012/06/the-three-gunas-how-to-balance-your-consciousness/


This is a very fine article indeed. But it says nothing about petrifying people because of memorial places. "Tamasic" means "leading to dullness". This has nothing to do with knowing about death and having memorial places or cemeteries.
If somebody died, it is better to give a place to this circumstance, even in your own house. One should allow that in order to become healthy.
And not only buddhists but also hindu-tantric yogies do meditation on cemeteries. It opens the mind instead of staying dull.

I also meditate on death and am aware of it's importance.

But then you must know, that there is no bad energy. To hide the death creates the bad energy.
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby justsit » Wed Jan 22, 2014 6:22 pm

We could call it, "The Stupa."
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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby pemachophel » Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:47 pm

I think such a section on this forum would be a fine idea and hope it is implemented.

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Re: Memorial/Passing Forum

Postby dharmagoat » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:29 pm

Sounds good to me.
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