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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:46 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm
Posts: 1358
how does samsara arise as nirvana?

i would like to have a conversation more detailed and quotes from scriptures and explanations that just an answer '' when you realize rigpa or buddhanature '' or whatever the term used is.

i am more interested in the process of transformation.

_________________
If the thought of demons
Never rises in your mind,
You need not fear the demon hosts around you.
It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned,
there are neither buddhas or demons.
He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue,
will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion.
Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

-Milarepa

OMMANIPADMEHUNG

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls6P9tOYmdo


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:30 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:13 am
Posts: 2199
When the snow melts, the flowers bloom

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A human being has his limits. And thus, in every conceivable way, with every possible means, he tries to make the teaching enter into his own limits. ChNN


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:33 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm
Posts: 1358
lol, im interested in more analytical view of the process and everything concerning the transformation of the psyche and mind in general. i would love to hear explanations and quotes concerning the twelve links of dependent origination and also Nagarjuna. anyone ?

_________________
If the thought of demons
Never rises in your mind,
You need not fear the demon hosts around you.
It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned,
there are neither buddhas or demons.
He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue,
will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion.
Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

-Milarepa

OMMANIPADMEHUNG

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls6P9tOYmdo


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:29 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:13 am
Posts: 2199
Malcolm would be the expert on this, but in Tibetan the word for buddha is 'sangye'. The first syllable means removal of obscurations, and the second means something like 'full expression'. So your Buddha Nature, which currently is the animating force for your personal perspective, emotionality, habits and such, is able to instead manifest as the qualities of a Buddha.

But like I said, this kind of thing is Malcolm's forte'.

_________________
A human being has his limits. And thus, in every conceivable way, with every possible means, he tries to make the teaching enter into his own limits. ChNN


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm
Posts: 1358
its a silly question in some sense, but i am looking to unravel the teachings conserning this transformation be it nagarjuna or any other master you can quote or talk about, or your own experience but i wish this to be an extensevi contemplation thread where we can contemplate all the factors concerning how to transform samsara into nirvana. i am fine with all traditions and schools view but im especially interested in vajrayana, mahayana and zen buddhism view and processes of this transformational process. the more quotes from scriptures in this thread i think makes it more beneficial, then we have some good content to and also ones own understanding makes this thread for me and hopefully other people very beneficial.

what are the factors and different teachings in this process that make a coherent picture and understanding of this transformational process. and no im not interested that much in metaphors because to me they dont reveal anything workable, theyre just imagination allthough beneficial in some cases. i need raw material that i can put inside my mind as a content to discover more knowledge and wisdom and point of view's.

im interested in alchemical point of view what ever you decide that it means, philosophical , analytical , and pure wisdom point of views. and of course your point of view :tongue: and the different schools and pathways view of this process.

what is essential to this process? ( not in view of conduct but by inquisition and knowledge and teachings that are essential in this process )
what is needed to be understood in a nutshell ? ( can include quotes to make a point )

and everything else you come up with concerning this topic. anything that is workable.

thankyou very much :namaste:

_________________
If the thought of demons
Never rises in your mind,
You need not fear the demon hosts around you.
It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned,
there are neither buddhas or demons.
He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue,
will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion.
Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

-Milarepa

OMMANIPADMEHUNG

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls6P9tOYmdo


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 10:42 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:38 am
Posts: 556
Nirvana doesn't arise or cease.
It is revealed through the process of cessation of illusions (ignorance).

"And what is ignorance? Not knowing stress, not knowing the origination of stress, not knowing the cessation of stress, not knowing the way of practice leading to the cessation of stress: This is called ignorance.

"Now from the remainderless fading & cessation of that very ignorance comes the cessation of fabrications. From the cessation of fabrications comes the cessation of consciousness. From the cessation of consciousness comes the cessation of name-&-form."

Paticca-samuppada-vibhanga Sutta: Analysis of Dependent Co-arising


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