HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

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HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby Indrajala » Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:50 am

    DHARAMSHALA: Dehra MLA and former minister Ravinder Singh Ravi said on Saturday that Tibetan spiritual leader Dalai Lama shifting to his new abode in Karnataka from McLeodganj will hit tourism in the state.

    "Dalai Lama had put Himachal on the world map. His moving out will hit tourism badly, which would affect revenue of the state," the former minister said at Palampur.

    "The cricket stadium here would serve the tourism purpose to some extent. It attracts thousands of cricket admirers from across the world during matches, but state government is bidding to spoil this. It has failed to foresee as to what will be left in this hill city, if Dalai Lama would not be there," said Ravi, lambasting the state government for initiating vigilance inquiries against Himachal Pradesh Cricket Association.

    The Dalai Lama had fled from China in 1959 with 80,000 Tibetans and took asylum in McLeodganj near here -- his exile home since then. The 78-year-old spiritual leader is apparently shifting to Tibetan settlements in south India, which are larger and well organized places in comparison to this exile hamlet. Once that happens, McLeodganj might become his temporary residence, hitting the prospects of this hill station, sources said.

    Major teachings by the Buddhist leader, which draw thousands of foreign tourists, have already been shifted to southern parts of the country. The residence of the Dalai Lama has already come up in a Tibetan settlement in Mysore, sources said here. However, Dalai Lama has not expressed his stand on shifting from McLeodganj so far.

    Tibetan activists here revealed that teachings of the Dalai Lama have been shifted to the south Indian settlements from McLeodganj due to lack of proper space and basic amenities here. "If 3,000 monks, along with followers from different countries, converge at McLeodganj, the situation would become very complicated here. It seems the authorities are neglecting the factual situation here," said a Tibetan, requesting anonymity.

    When contacted, Tenzin Takla, private secretary to Dalai Lama, confirmed that a residence for the spiritual leader has already come up in Mysore.


http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 043257.cms

All things considered, I think McLeodganj is rather cramped. HHDL gives public teachings and Namgyal isn't really able to accommodate the crowds so well. Some people have to sit upstairs or downstairs and watch a TV monitor.
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby Karma Dorje » Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:02 am

What is more potentially more interesting than the logistical problems of McLeodganj is that where he is going to is the Nyingma monastery of Namdroling:

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/namd ... 97904.html
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby JKhedrup » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:22 am

I heard that one reason is because as His Holiness gets older they worry that McLeod Ganj is quite far from well equipped hospitals. Namdroling is in the Bylakuppe settlement, which is quite near Mysore and Bangalore, where there are excellent modern medical facilities. Some are also saying that maybe HH will move to the settlement in Northern Karnataka, near Hubli, so this all seems to be in the discussion stages.

I imagine HH would visit Dharamsala regularly as his personal monastery, Namgyal, is there as well as the largest Tibetan Children's village. One monk mentioned to me that he may split time between north and south, avoiding dharamsala during wet and cold periods which are difficult on his joints as he gets older. So there are many rumours and reasons floating around.
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby plwk » Mon Aug 26, 2013 9:07 am

"Dalai Lama had put Himachal on the world map. His moving out will hit tourism badly, which would affect revenue of the state," the former minister said at Palampur.

And he never once thought of how the state & federal govts could have developed the place after all these years for the overall socio-economic well being of the community there to be independent and diversified but is still expecting HHDL to maintain their relish for a personality cult to feed the tourism industry there?
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby Lhasa » Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:39 pm

I watched part of the live webcast last night, and as HHDL was walking inside, there was a security officer with an openly displayed automatic rifle walking about six feet in front on him and another behind him, turning and scanning the crowd and looking absolutely 'spooked'. Maybe they think they can't protect him there anymore.
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby Indrajala » Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:41 pm

Lhasa wrote:Maybe they think they can't protect him there anymore.


With the bombings in Bodhgaya, I imagine his security detail is on high alert 24/7.
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby zangskar » Mon Aug 26, 2013 8:24 pm

Bylakuppe is a nice place, I understand why HH might want to go there. Does any of you know if Westerners still need to apply in advance for a special permit to visit the settlement?
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby JKhedrup » Tue Aug 27, 2013 9:13 am

Please arrange a PAP (Protected Area Permit) through either the Bureau of HH Dalai Lama in Dharamsala or the Ministry of Home Affairs of the Govt of India at Jaisalmer House in Delhi. Previously I would have said for very short stays not to worry about it, but with heightened security risks for Buddhist communities in India the police are enforcing the permits very strictly. You will be booted from the settlement if they catch you without one, and could be fined or even spend the night in jail. It is not like before.

Being caught without a PAP can also lead to any Tibetan friends involved in your visit being subjected to extra scrutiny by the Indian authorities, and lead to tremendous inconvenience.

More information: http://www.jangchuplamrim.org/how-to-at ... ermit-pap/
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby Malcolm » Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:51 pm

Indrajala wrote:All things considered, I think McLeodganj is rather cramped. HHDL gives public teachings and Namgyal isn't really able to accommodate the crowds so well. Some people have to sit upstairs or downstairs and watch a TV monitor.


Simply put, South India is nicer than North India. The food is better, the people nicer. Mysore is a decent city, Bangalore supposed to be even better.

HHDL is basically a Nyingmapa anyway, so it is fitting for him to be installed in a Nyingma monastery.
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby JKhedrup » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:08 pm

Bangalore is in my opinion by far the nicest city in India. It also has excellent, modern medical facilities.

I love the mountains personally, but would have to agree that in general the quality of life is better in South India. My only fear if HHDL moves there is that it will be harder to Westerners to attend his teachings as the whole PAP permit thing is a massive hassle and sometimes even one applies it doesn't arrive in time. But if this inconvenience to us Injis makes things safer for His Holiness, it is worth it.

Another factor to consider is that there are far more Tibetans living in the settlements in the South than in the North, so he will be able to more directly benefit them. Not to mention the thousands of ordained Sangha in the large surrounding monasteries.

I would personally rather see HHDL in Bylakuppe (where Namdroling and Sera are) than Mundgod (Ganden and Drepung, which has also been mentioned as a possibility in some of the press). Bylakuppe is in a lovely part of Karnataka with rolling hills and tea plantations, near the major cities of Bangalore and Mysore. Hubli is in a parched, drought striken area with massive mosquitos and unattractice cityscapes.
In order to ensure my mind never comes under the power of the self-cherishing attitude,
I must obtain control over my own mind.
Therefore, amongst all empowerments, the empowerment that gives me control over my mind is the best,
and I have received the most profound empowerment with this teaching.
-Atisha Dipamkara
brtsal ba'i bkhra drin
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby Clarence » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:10 pm

Wouldn't he live at Sera then instead of Namdroling? Aren't they somewhat close together?
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby JKhedrup » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:19 pm

Even though I love the mountains I agree that the quality of life in South India is generally higher. My only concern is that it will be more difficult for Westerners to attend teachings with His Holiness in India due to the PAP permits, which have to be applied for way in advance and due to various bottlenecks are sometimes not even issued in time.

What I have heard, and read in the Asian press, is that there are two possibilities IF (key word if) HHDL moves to the South. One is Namdroling in the Bylakuppe settlement of the Palyul Nyingma lineage, and the other is Drepung in the Mundgod settlement.

I personally would rather see HH stay in Bylakuppe- I don't mind at all if that means he stays in a Nyingma monastery. It is a walk across some fields or 10 minutes auto-rickshaw ride from Sera Monastery.

The Bylakuppe settlement is by far the more comfortable of the two. Firstly, it is nearer to attractive major cities like Bylakuppe and Bangalore. It is in the Coorg area of Karnataka, a pleasant land of rolling hills and coffee plantations with a somewhat moderate climate (for South India!) and tolerable monsoon.

The Mundgod settlement near Hubli is in Northern Karnataka- far from the lovely cities of Mysore and Bangalore. The area is drought-striken and dusty, and even harder for foreigners to visit than Bylakuppe due to a nearby military installation.
In order to ensure my mind never comes under the power of the self-cherishing attitude,
I must obtain control over my own mind.
Therefore, amongst all empowerments, the empowerment that gives me control over my mind is the best,
and I have received the most profound empowerment with this teaching.
-Atisha Dipamkara
brtsal ba'i bkhra drin
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Re: HHDL leaving Dharamsala?

Postby zangskar » Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:05 pm

JKhedrup wrote:Please arrange a PAP (Protected Area Permit) through either the Bureau of HH Dalai Lama in Dharamsala or the Ministry of Home Affairs of the Govt of India at Jaisalmer House in Delhi. Previously I would have said for very short stays not to worry about it, but with heightened security risks for Buddhist communities in India the police are enforcing the permits very strictly. You will be booted from the settlement if they catch you without one, and could be fined or even spend the night in jail. It is not like before.

Being caught without a PAP can also lead to any Tibetan friends involved in your visit being subjected to extra scrutiny by the Indian authorities, and lead to tremendous inconvenience.

More information: http://www.jangchuplamrim.org/how-to-at ... ermit-pap/

Thanks. I was there about 10 years ago at which time I had no idea about the necessary permits until after I had been there for a few days.
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