Toni Packer

Toni Packer

Postby greentara » Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:07 am

"when has zazen ever had anything to do with sitting on a cushion?"

Well, of course -- when sitting on a cushion. Here, I sit on a swing in the backyard, or inside on a couch during the winter storms. I don't call it zazen. Maybe it's not. Who cares? When I sit, the whole universe is sitting. When I stand, guess who stands up? If anybody knew who was really doing what, they wouldn't be able to place a name for it. Nope, they wouldn't need to say a word at all. Otherwise, call it what you will, it's probably vanity regardless. What I like about Toni is, you won't find much if any vanity there. That's what's rare"

Genkaku, letter section
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby rachmiel » Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:30 am

I did several retreats with Toni in the Springwater Center. She's very down to earth, simple, modest. Profoundly influenced by Krishnamurti's teachings. Work of the moment, everyday awareness as meditation rather than (or in addition to) formal on-the-cushion sitting.
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby jeeprs » Thu Aug 15, 2013 2:09 am

I always really liked Krishnamurti and still do, but never got any real understanding of what he was talking about without time 'on the cushion'. Otherwise it is all 'listening to talks' and 'watching videos' and 'thinking how profound it is'.

On the other hand, I am very mindful of the mind's ability to create 'idols' of whatever it believes in through emotional projection and wanting to defend itself. I got a lot of that from Krishnamurti but again to get it on more than a verbal level, takes something more than 'reading krishnamurti'.
He that knows it, knows it not.
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby rachmiel » Thu Aug 15, 2013 2:34 am

The practice part of Krishnamurti's teachings is in his form of meditation, moment-to-moment choiceless awareness. Living with/in this awareness is a life changer.
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby greentara » Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:34 am

Toni was also influenced by Kapleau Roshi although she didn't like all the rituals involved.
Jidhu Krishnamurti's writings were inspirational but he didn't seem to follow his own teaching. He loved to shop and buy expensive Saville row suits and was quite elitist. He didn't mingle with the common man but was very friendly and mixed freely with the English aristocracy.
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby dzogchungpa » Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:41 am

greentara wrote:Jidhu Krishnamurti's writings were inspirational but he didn't seem to follow his own teaching. He loved to shop and buy expensive Saville row suits and was quite elitist. He didn't mingle with the common man but was very friendly and mixed freely with the English aristocracy.

Did he teach that one shouldn't do those things?
ཨོཾ་མ་ཧཱ་ཤུནྱ་ཏཱ་ཛྙཱ་ན་བཛྲ་སྭཱ་བྷཱ་བ་ཨཱཏྨ་ཀོ་྅ཧཾ༔

The thousands of lines of the Prajnaparamita can be summed up in the following two sentences:
1) One should become a Bodhisattva (or, Buddha-to-be), i.e. one who is content with nothing less than all-knowledge attained through the perfection of wisdom for the sake of all beings.
2) There is no such thing as a Bodhisattva, or as all-knowledge, or as a ‘being’, or as the perfection of wisdom, or as an attainment.
To accept both these contradictory facts is to be perfect.
- Conze
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby greentara » Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:10 am

All I can say is if you are living in 'choiceless awareness' as Krishnamurti taught. He was very choosy in what he bought, how he lived and who he mingled with.
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby dzogchungpa » Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:20 am

greentara wrote:All I can say is if you are living in 'choiceless awareness' as Krishnamurti taught. He was very choosy in what he bought, how he lived and who he mingled with.

Well, I haven't read much of his stuff, but I doubt that he taught that people should not make choices.
ཨོཾ་མ་ཧཱ་ཤུནྱ་ཏཱ་ཛྙཱ་ན་བཛྲ་སྭཱ་བྷཱ་བ་ཨཱཏྨ་ཀོ་྅ཧཾ༔

The thousands of lines of the Prajnaparamita can be summed up in the following two sentences:
1) One should become a Bodhisattva (or, Buddha-to-be), i.e. one who is content with nothing less than all-knowledge attained through the perfection of wisdom for the sake of all beings.
2) There is no such thing as a Bodhisattva, or as all-knowledge, or as a ‘being’, or as the perfection of wisdom, or as an attainment.
To accept both these contradictory facts is to be perfect.
- Conze
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Re: Toni Packer

Postby jeeprs » Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:24 am

The First and Last Freedom with the foreword by Alduous Huxley is a perennial book in my view. As a person Krishnamurti had his weakenesses but he is well worth reading.
He that knows it, knows it not.
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