Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

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Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby Kunzang8 » Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:41 am

Hi

In the Four Mandala Offerings to Tara Sadhana, there is a section on offering Torma. If one does not have a torma offering, what does one do??

If I get one of those wooden torma representations, does it mean I don't need and actual torma? Where can I get on by the way. Thanks.
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby heart » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:59 am

Kunzang8 wrote:Hi

In the Four Mandala Offerings to Tara Sadhana, there is a section on offering Torma. If one does not have a torma offering, what does one do??

If I get one of those wooden torma representations, does it mean I don't need and actual torma? Where can I get on by the way. Thanks.


You can offer a serkyem with tea and some biscuits on the side, or just a biscuit. I use digestives.

There are many kinds of torma. Some represent the deity, or the protectors and some represents offerings of various kinds. So you have to get the right torma. Getting the deity tormas can be quite difficult. The others you can learn how to make.

If you have the possibility to participate in this; http://www.phakchokrinpoche.org/schedul ... al-courses
It will resolve all your problems.

/magnus
"To reject practice by saying, 'it is conceptual!' is the path of fools. A tendency of the inexperienced and something to be avoided."
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby JKhedrup » Sun Aug 11, 2013 1:59 pm

My teachers have also indicated to me that the torma offering can be visualized, or also left out if one is pressed for time.
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby Silent Bob » Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:22 pm

Here is an appropriate torma for Four Mandalas practice:
http://www.potalagate.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1374015639&PNAME=Peaceful+White+Torma+in+Wood+%23+8
and another:
http://www.potalagate.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1047850448&PNAME=PEACEFUL+WHITE+TORMA_Shewa+Shaltze+%237
which goes here:
http://www.potalagate.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1055094210&PNAME=TORMA+PLATE++COPPER+Sm+%231

I was taught to refresh the torma every day with white-colored cookies on a separate little plate which is placed beside the offering torma, but I've found it simpler to use Cheerios, one by one.

Here is a nice GT deity torma (phuktor) for your shrine:
https://www.zambala.com/product_info.php?cPath=285_355&products_id=317&osCsid=c384936f8ffcaffe6f9c925a8039f1cd
There is a procedure for blessing new phuktors or statues with rolled-up mantras (and other things) placed inside, but a description of that will have to wait for another time.

Chris
"All the sublime teachings, so profound--to throw away one and then grab yet another will not bear even a single fruit. Persevere, therefore, in simply one."
--Dudjom Rinpoche, "Nectar for the Hearts of Fortunate Disciples. Song No. 8"
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:03 pm

I make a shal say torma, when I have the time, or use white biscuits and tea when feeling lazy.
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Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby Kunzang8 » Mon Aug 12, 2013 2:35 am

JKhedrup wrote:My teachers have also indicated to me that the torma offering can be visualized, or also left out if one is pressed for time.


1) I thought you can replace offerings by visualization only if it is something like HYT, not sure what category this practice is.

2) When you say leave out, do you mean leave out the actual torma offerings or reciting the torma part altogether?
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby JKhedrup » Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:53 am

Chittamani Tara is a Highest Yoga Tantra practice.

When you say leave out, do you mean leave out the actual torma offerings or reciting the torma part altogether?


I have been taught when really pressed for time they can be left out (the abbreviated Guru Yoga practice of Chittamani Tara doesn't include torma offerings anyways), though of course it is best to do them.

HHDL has mentioned the torma offering is important though not nearly as important as the practice of Taking the Three Bodies (death, intermediate state and rebirth) into the path.

I have not heard that including or leaving our torma offerings has anything to do with which class of tantra the practice is, though of course simply because I haven't heard that doesn't mean it is incorrect! (I am learning new things all the time).
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
-Sakya Pandita
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby heart » Mon Aug 12, 2013 5:22 am

The only "Four Mandala Offerings to Tara" that I know of is from the Chokling Tersar and is considered a kriya yoga practice, however since it is a terma it isn't as simple as that. Are there a "Four Mandala Offerings to Tara" in the Chittamani Tara practice?

/magnus
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby JKhedrup » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:53 pm

There are several different Chittamani Tara practice texts, including a short guru yoga, a longer sadhana, the four mandala offerings, and various retreat rituals and completion stage practices.
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
-Sakya Pandita
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby ngodrup » Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:32 pm

There is a Green Tara within the Dudjom Tersar that is mahayoga, i.e. HYT.
This particular practice has its own associated tsog.
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby Kunzang8 » Sat Aug 17, 2013 2:21 pm

heart wrote:If you have the possibility to participate in this; http://www.phakchokrinpoche.org/schedul ... al-courses
It will resolve all your problems.

/magnus


Is the Ritual Sadhana Course Tara practice the Four mandala offering Tara Practice? I thought it was a different one.
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Re: Four Mandala Offerings to Tara

Postby heart » Sat Aug 17, 2013 4:10 pm

Kunzang8 wrote:
heart wrote:If you have the possibility to participate in this; http://www.phakchokrinpoche.org/schedul ... al-courses
It will resolve all your problems.

/magnus


Is the Ritual Sadhana Course Tara practice the Four mandala offering Tara Practice? I thought it was a different one.


There are two courses this year as I understand it, one on Trinley Nyingpo and one on the outer sadhana in the Zabtig Drolma cycle called "The Essence of the Two Accumulations, The Mandala Ritual from the Mind Treasure, The Profound Essence of Tara". If it is this practice you are doing then this is the correct course.

/magnus
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