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 Post subject: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:24 pm 
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I was at the Asian Civlizations Museum in Singapore today and found this. It is from the Tokugawa era in Japan when Christianity was outlawed. Someone could covertly worship the cross.


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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:09 pm 
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Very interesting. Thank you for sharing, Indrajala!
I would never believe, before I see it, that it existed such a symbol.

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Sat Jul 27, 2013 1:39 pm 
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Quote:
Someone could covertly worship the cross.


An iron cross eh.
Seems very natural to have a female or crucified Buddha. However some prefer their icons clearly labeled.
Shakyamuni, King of the Buddhas.
. . . maybe repos are available . . . I think I would use one . . . :popcorn:

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 8:06 am 
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gives me the creeps, really fascinating though. I've seen icons of Kannon that stood for the Virgin Mary.
gassho
Rory

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 8:20 am 
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I saw a photograph of a similar 'hybrid' style of icon from, I think, the Gandhara era, silver, many years ago in a journal. I was interested in finding out more, but never managed to track it down again. I wondered if it might be related to the so-called Jesus Sutras of the Nestorian Christians, who managed to get as far as Imperial China.

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In 1907, explorers discovered a vast treasure trove of ancient scrolls, silk paintings, and artifacts dating from the 5th to 11th centuries A.D. in a long-sealed cave in a remote region of China. Among them, written in Chinese, were scrolls that recounted a history of Jesus' life and teachings in beautiful Taoist concepts and imagery that were unknown in the West. These writings told a story of Christianity that was by turns unique and disturbing, hopeful and uplifting. The best way to describe them is collectively, with a term they themselves use: The Jesus Sutras.

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 8:26 am 
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Gnostics would be proud of it.

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 12:13 pm 
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Ven Indrajala, a 'crucifix' / 'cruci fixus' is technically a cross with a fixed carving of a crucified Christ on it.
The one in the pic looks like a plain cross with a carved image of a Buddha, although I can't see the back side of it...

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 5:26 am 
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Ah, okay.

Basically it is a covert Christian symbol. They would stick it on the wall and people would think they were worshipping the Buddha.

In the Tokugawa period being a Christian was prohibited.

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 7:09 am 
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I remember seeing a documentary about some mirrors that appeared normal but reflected Christian images before.


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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 7:21 am 
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I don't see much harm in it. Seems like a win-win.


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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 8:45 am 
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Or a lose-lose! :tongue:

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 2:33 am 
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Sorry the crucifix where Jesus is crucified for your sins , the load of guilt plus you'll never be a christus/a is a billion miles away from a Buddha whom we all can become. Not to mention that Jews (my people) have been discriminated and murdered in Jesus' name for 2 millenia. Buddhism is much more syncretic and prefers to absorb rather than persecute...
gassho
rory

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:35 am 
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rory wrote:
Sorry the crucifix where Jesus is crucified for your sins , the load of guilt plus you'll never be a christus/a is a billion miles away from a Buddha whom we all can become. Not to mention that Jews (my people) have been discriminated and murdered in Jesus' name for 2 millenia. Buddhism is much more syncretic and prefers to absorb rather than persecute...
gassho
rory

But Rory, this buddha-on-a-cross was never intended as a Buddhist symbol, if Indrajala is correct. The Buddha-figure was just stuck on the cross to camouflage an object which was intended to be, and used as, a strictly Christian symbol.
The similarities and differences between the two religions are therefore quite beside the point. So are their habits of borrowing/absorbing ideas from other religions, which is a whole topic in itself.

:namaste:
Kim


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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 9:07 am 
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I was replying to the win-win, idea that it's all okay, good etc...symbols have tremendous power. To a Japanese covert Christian that was a helpful symbol; to me seeing the buddha on a cross is amazingly upsetting.

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 Post subject: Re: Buddha on a crucifix
PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:12 am 
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rory wrote:
I was replying to the win-win, idea that it's all okay, good etc...symbols have tremendous power. To a Japanese covert Christian that was a helpful symbol; to me seeing the buddha on a cross is amazingly upsetting.

Thanks for your explanation, and it does make sense - our responses are highly dependent on our prior experiences. But perhaps you could have made it clear that you were responding to a particular post and from a different perspective?

:namaste:
Kim


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