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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:31 pm 
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To what extent is the following accurate or inaccurate?

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Advaita has it that there is an ultimate reality, Brahman (consciousness, Self with a capital S, etc.).

Buddhism's middle way has it that there is neither an ultimate reality nor no ultimate reality, because both "positions" are conceptual, and all concepts are empty of inherent meaning.

So Advaitans have an ultimate ground to stand on (kinda sorta): Brahman. Buddhist middle wayers have no ground to stand on, except perhaps for Buddha nature, which is not really a ground because it is emptiness, which is groundless.

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Thanks for the help. :-)

rachMiel

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:03 pm 
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"Buddhism's middle way has it that there is neither an ultimate reality nor no ultimate reality, because both "positions" are conceptual, and all concepts are empty of inherent meaning. "

On what basis do you assert that "Buddhism's middle way" has it that way?


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:27 am 
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dude wrote:
"Buddhism's middle way has it that there is neither an ultimate reality nor no ultimate reality, because both "positions" are conceptual, and all concepts are empty of inherent meaning. "

On what basis do you assert that "Buddhism's middle way" has it that way?

I based it on the Chán Buddhist Middle Way, which (per Wikipedia) "describes the realization of being free of the one-sidedness of perspective that takes the extremes of any polarity as objective reality." There is an ultimate reality and there is no ultimate reality are polar opposites. To accept one pole as true (thus the other as false) goes against the Middle Way.

My explanation of *why* this goes against the Middle Way is my interpretation, and might not be the same explanation a Chán Buddhist Middle Wayer would give.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:46 am 
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You have a very weird idea of what the expression, "middle way" means.

I have an idea of what you're trying to get at though: the rejection of nihilism and absolute existence by the Buddha. The reason both of those are rejected is because the Buddha's view is one of dependent arising. Dependent arising of phenomenon is not nihilism or absolute existence.

As for the "middle way" phrase, there's a lot of weird ideas about it meaning just do whatever action is in the middle of a spectrum of actions.
So if you have a 10 quart tub of ice cream, don't eat none or all of the ice cream, eat 5 quarts of ice cream.
So if you're driving, drive in the middle of the road.
So if you're breast feeding, put your child's face between both your nipples.
So if you're brushing your teeth, brush only half of your teeth.
lol Obviously this is not what the Buddha taught.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 9:13 am 
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Off-topic discussion deleted. For unending discussions and multi coulured Sutra quotes on the self/Self issue please refer to this overly-long and tedious thread. :tongue:

A quick forum search turns up 33 pages of references to the term "advaita". Some threads that may be of interest are this thirteen page discussion (also started by rachmiel) and this one.

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