Was Osho Enlightened?

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Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby duffster » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:10 pm

Hi

Was Osho enlightened?i know he wasn't teaching traditional strutcured Dharma,but seems he had realization.Was it the Dalai lama who said he was an Enlightened master?Was he teaching the same message as the Buddha just a different approach?
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:35 pm

duffster wrote:Was Osho enlightened?
Who knows? He was a good business man though. That's for sure!
i know he wasn't teaching traditional strutcured Dharma,but seems he had realization.
"Seems" according to what/who?
Was it the Dalai lama who said he was an Enlightened master?
I doubt it. Osho would have liked that the Dalai Lama said something like this but...
Was he teaching the same message as the Buddha just a different approach?
How can something be the same and different too?
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Jikan » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:45 pm

duffster wrote:Hi

Was Osho enlightened?i know he wasn't teaching traditional strutcured Dharma,but seems he had realization.Was it the Dalai lama who said he was an Enlightened master?Was he teaching the same message as the Buddha just a different approach?



Probably not, no.


http://www.oregonlive.com/rajneesh/
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby duffster » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:49 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:
duffster wrote:Was Osho enlightened?
Who knows? He was a good business man though. That's for sure!
i know he wasn't teaching traditional strutcured Dharma,but seems he had realization.
Seems according to what/who?
Was it the Dalai lama who said he was an Enlightened master?
I doubt it. Osho would have liked that the Dalai Lama said something like this but...
Was he teaching the same message as the Buddha just a different approach?
How can something be the same and different too?


Thanks for picking my post apart and making me feel like a christmas turkey!
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:52 pm

Sorry? You were not looking for answers? :shrug:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby duffster » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:58 pm

Jikan wrote:
duffster wrote:Hi

Was Osho enlightened?i know he wasn't teaching traditional strutcured Dharma,but seems he had realization.Was it the Dalai lama who said he was an Enlightened master?Was he teaching the same message as the Buddha just a different approach?



Probably not, no.


http://www.oregonlive.com/rajneesh/


Thanks for the link,wasn't Sheela the culprit regarding a lot of the craziness?
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby duffster » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:59 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:Sorry? You were not looking for answers? :shrug:

yes i was but take it easy on me please,im a newbie...
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Jikan » Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:12 pm

duffster wrote:Thanks for the link,wasn't Sheela the culprit regarding a lot of the craziness?


I have no idea how to attribute responsibility for whose actions in that context. I do think the documents and other historical records speak for themselves.

:anjali:
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby duffster » Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:19 pm

There is a article online about one of Osho's students who visited the 16th Karmapa.he said the Karmapa told him Osho was a very important reincarnated master.is article pure fantasy?i can find the link,but im sure people has heard about it?
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby PadmaVonSamba » Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:25 pm

So-so.
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The Chinese characters are Fo (buddha) and Ming (bright). The image is of a student of Buddhism, who, imagining himself to be a monk, and not understanding the true meaning of the words takes the sound of the words literally. Likewise, People on web forums sometime seem to be foaming at the mouth.
Original painting by P.Volker /used by permission.
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:34 pm

duffster wrote:There is a article online about one of Osho's students who visited the 16th Karmapa.he said the Karmapa told him Osho was a very important reincarnated master.is article pure fantasy?i can find the link,but im sure people has heard about it?
I heard (from good sources) that Osho went to the Karmapa to ask for the Chenrezig initiation and the 16th Karmapa just looked at him whereupon Osho got up and left. :shrug:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby duffster » Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:38 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:
duffster wrote:There is a article online about one of Osho's students who visited the 16th Karmapa.he said the Karmapa told him Osho was a very important reincarnated master.is article pure fantasy?i can find the link,but im sure people has heard about it?
I heard (from good sources) that Osho went to the Karmapa to ask for the Chenrezig initiation and the 16th Karmapa just looked at him whereupon Osho got up and left. :shrug:


I see..
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby oushi » Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:51 pm

duffster wrote:Hi

Was Osho enlightened?i know he wasn't teaching traditional strutcured Dharma,but seems he had realization.Was it the Dalai lama who said he was an Enlightened master?Was he teaching the same message as the Buddha just a different approach?

Depends on how you define enlightenment. :smile:
If you like his teachings, why ask others?
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby dyanaprajna2011 » Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:38 pm

Personally, I'm not a fan. His anti-Semitism and condoning of euthanasia bothers me. He is also against homosexuality, which is a topic debatable by itself, but I personally don't have any issues with homosexuals. He spoke out against Gandhi, which I have no idea why someone would have done that. He was against socialism, which I consider myself a socialist. He was against 'institutionalized' religion, which could be either good or bad. He was also a hippy about sex, advocating for open sexuality. Basically what he did was he took teachings from all the wisdom and mystical traditions, and repackaged them as his own unique teachings. So I don't, personally, believe he was enlightened.
"If you want to travel the Way of Buddhas and Zen masters, then expect nothing, seek nothing, and grasp nothing." -Dogen
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Nosta » Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:01 pm

I think Osho is not enlightened. he is just a guy mixing Dharma themes with personal ideas.

Wandering monks on Thailand (just to give an example) have more elightenment than him. They really live the Dharma and are not selling books as an objective by itself.
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby dzogchungpa » Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:10 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:I heard (from good sources) that Osho went to the Karmapa to ask for the Chenrezig initiation and the 16th Karmapa just looked at him whereupon Osho got up and left. :shrug:

Thats an interesting story. May I ask what your sources thought the meaning of that was?
ཨོཾ་མ་ཧཱ་ཤུནྱ་ཏཱ་ཛྙཱ་ན་བཛྲ་སྭཱ་བྷཱ་བ་ཨཱཏྨ་ཀོ་྅ཧཾ༔

The thousands of lines of the Prajnaparamita can be summed up in the following two sentences:
1) One should become a Bodhisattva (or, Buddha-to-be), i.e. one who is content with nothing less than all-knowledge attained through the perfection of wisdom for the sake of all beings.
2) There is no such thing as a Bodhisattva, or as all-knowledge, or as a ‘being’, or as the perfection of wisdom, or as an attainment.
To accept both these contradictory facts is to be perfect.
- Conze
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:44 pm

Basically that the Karmapa saw why Osho was asking this from him and decided it was not such a good idea to give it to him.
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby Dronma » Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:19 pm

dyanaprajna2011 wrote:Basically what he did was he took teachings from all the wisdom and mystical traditions, and repackaged them as his own unique teachings. So I don't, personally, believe he was enlightened.


It is what I also think about Osho. I am not impressed at all by his "fruit-salad" teachings. Maybe it was something new for '60s and '70s, but I cannot see why people could be interested in his ideas nowadays..... :shrug:
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby greentara » Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:41 am

Indeed people are still interested in Osho's teachings. Wandering through India I met people who had come from the ashram in Puna. Alot of them were pleasure seekers, talking about the different events at the ashram, meditation 'wild dancing' swimming pool etc and you had to pay all the way...nothing was free.
We shouldn't be surprised as Osho himself stated that he was there for the rich. The devotees lapped it up, the 99 RollsRoyces, the hedonism, everything was excessive.
Sheila was just a reflection of what was going on, she had too much power and not the wisdom to handle it. Osho didn't appear to have his finger on the pulse nor the insight to handle it....the rest is history.
In retrospect some of his early books were of interest but he didn't live the teaching, he was articulate but just talked the talk. He had a few people behind the scenes who wrote humorous material for him so some of his jokes were ok and lots of material on Nasruddin.
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Re: Was Osho Enlightened?

Postby jeeprs » Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:10 am

I encountered Rajneesh before he became famous (or notorious) via one of his early books, in the University Library, whilst I was studying comparative religion and other texts on enlightenment. I learned he had been a lecturer at an Indian university, and as a result, was very learned and a good writer and speaker. I thought he was extremely clever in the literary sense, in terms of being able to express subtle ideas, and very well versed in Eastern lore.

Nevertheless I suspected he was a phony. A few years later the whole Orange People thing began to happen. It was big here in Sydney. Then the Oregon debacle with the Rolls Royces and that obnoxious Indian female lieutenant of his who became infamous for saying 'tough titties' in a Sixty Minutes interview.

At that stage I thought he was worse than a phony. I thought he was real disappointment, and also a menace. But on the other hand there were plenty of people willing to be taken in by him.

Since then I have read a few excerpts of his talks and books. Again, I observed that he was definitely very knowledgeable and has some experience of what he's talking about. He made some acute observations. But overall for putting himself forward as a 'great guru' and bringing the notion of the spiritual search into disrepute, he was definitely a phony. That's my two cents.
He that knows it, knows it not.
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