The Third Eye

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Namgyal
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Namgyal » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:07 pm

Last edited by Namgyal on Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CrawfordHollow
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby CrawfordHollow » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:09 pm

"Such visualizations should not be clung to as true, as entities with their own characteristics. In actuality they are the self-appearance of the wisdom mandala. As such they are devoid of the conceptual characteristics of color, shape, face, hands, and the rest, yet the various attributes of the support and supported do manifest as signs that symbolize the qualities of self-appearing buddhahood to those who are to be tamed... Three eyes symbolize seeing throughout the three times..."

Kunkyen Tenpe Nyima
The Compendium of Oral Instructions

Vajra Wisdom
Dharmachakra Translation Committee

So it seems at least from the perspective of generation stage that the third eye is a symbol for purity and not part of any subtle body to be worked with. I am by no means an expert here so I could be totally wrong, I just wanted to include some references. I am not saying that there is no subtle body at all. As far as I know the channels and winds do exist relatively and must be worked with during advanced stages of practice. I have just never heard of any "third eye" being included here.

Troy

Andrew108
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Andrew108 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:41 pm

Last edited by Andrew108 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.

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Karma Dondrup Tashi
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Karma Dondrup Tashi » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:41 pm


Andrew108
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Andrew108 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:52 pm

The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.

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Karma Dondrup Tashi
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Karma Dondrup Tashi » Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:05 pm


CrawfordHollow
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby CrawfordHollow » Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:15 pm

I still don't see any real evidence that the third eye is any more than a symbol in Vajrayana Buddhsim. Some deities also have four arms and three faces, but that doesn't mean that we need to grow extra appendages to reach enlightenment. I will happily be proved wrong, and I am not trying to be difficult, but from everthing that I have seen it seems like the third eye is no more than a symbol of purity. In either case I don't think that anyone would argue that the "practice"that the OP gleamed off the internet has absolutely no relevance to Buddhsim. Even the quote from Robert Beer that was presented earlier puts the "third eye" in quotations, implying that this is no more that a western idea that he is applying to Buddhsim for the clarity of his readers. Again, I could be completely wrong.

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Karma Dondrup Tashi
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Karma Dondrup Tashi » Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:30 pm

Everything is a symbol including enlightenment.

:quoteunquote:

No-one is disputing that there is a view.

The question as with many difficult questions is finding the exceedingly tiny balancing point between the two truths for purposes of skillful means.

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kirtu
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby kirtu » Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:45 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

CrawfordHollow
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby CrawfordHollow » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:29 pm

I guess I still feel that the "opening of the third eye" is not a Buddhist concept (for lack of a better word), symbolic or otherwise. The practices of tsa lung work with the channels and winds, but are there any practices that one can point to that specifically work to open this third eye? Otherwise I would say that we are mixing up ideas and traditions here. But perhaps the conversation has moved beyond this point.

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tobes
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby tobes » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:40 pm


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tobes
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby tobes » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:50 pm

And to Motova - I'm sorry the thread has become somewhat distracted from your OP. I hope you have found it interesting nonetheless.

I think what perhaps we'd all agree on is that Buddhism - all forms of Buddhism - does not deny what you might call paranormal phenomena.

And in some respects, it may see such phenomena as expressive of more heightened states of consciousness than everyday empirical awareness. But these states are not privileged in any way; they are generally treated as mundane - and are often considered a distraction from what is genuinely spiritually fruitful and wholesome.

My own personal view - which others may not agree with - is that it is far better to be open and inquisitive about non-empirical states of awareness than not. And that it is good to investigate. You're trying to find what is there, what you are, what you are capable of. That is the kind of spirit that can lead you to wholesome paths.

All the best in your pursuit of such a thing.

:anjali:

CrawfordHollow
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby CrawfordHollow » Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:33 am

I agree with you that the third eye is not the sole property of a western new age tradition. What seems "new agey" to me is that you can get practices like this from a source like the internet and perform them without a teacher or lineage. Forgive me if I was closed-minded, I was just being honest. I have truly never encountered the idea that there is a third eye that can worked with and opened through practice in Vajrayana Buddhism. I have had teachings on the channels and winds, but no third eye. It just doesn't sound Buddhist to me, but again I could be wrong. I gave a quote from Kunkyen Tenpe Nyima that clearly states that the three eyes of the deities are attributes of enlightenment, in this case symbolizing the ability to see into the three times. So I don't think that my position is all that strange really.

To the OP, since you asked about Buddhism, I would of course encourage you to seek out a teacher and learn as much as you can about the Dharma. There are so many practices that you can start right now, including shamatha, tonglen, and analytical meditation. Here are some resources that may help you: http://www.rinpoche.com and http://www.shenpen-osel.org

Motova
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Motova » Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:00 am

Thanks everyone, I appreciate all the feedback and discussion. :cheers:
Last edited by DGA on Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: removed user's name

Andrew108
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Andrew108 » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:45 am

The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.

Namgyal
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Namgyal » Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:41 am


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conebeckham
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby conebeckham » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:31 pm



"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

Simon E.
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Simon E. » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:38 pm

Well put.
" My heart's in the Highlands
my heart is not here.
My heart's in the Highlands
chasing the deer."

Robert V.C. Burns.

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Karma Dondrup Tashi
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby Karma Dondrup Tashi » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:55 pm


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conebeckham
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Re: The Third Eye

Postby conebeckham » Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:03 pm

Interesting quote, Karma Dondrup Tashi. Perhaps it's a special Dzogchen term for a chakra I'm not familiar with. Would love to see a primary source, in Tibetan, though, but CNNR using the term does give it some credence.


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")


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