Dolpo Dharma ?

[Aemilius]

As some of you know tibetan language doesn't favour words beginning with a vocal, neither can tibetan language accept diftongs, diftongs become single vocals, au becomes o etc... For this and other reasons I have concluded that "Lama Dolpopa" means Lama Europe. It refers to an european person who came to Tibet and was active there. "Dolpo Sanggye" means European Buddha, "Dolpo Sherab Sanggye" means European Wisdom Buddha. Tibetans favour the word "western" because they can't say "european".

[Will]

As some of you know tibetan language doesn't favour words beginning with a vocal, neither can tibetan language accept diftongs, diftongs become single vocals, au becomes o etc... For this and other reasons I have concluded that "Lama Dolpopa" means Lama Europe. It refers to an european person who came to Tibet and was active there. "Dolpo Sanggye" means European Buddha, "Dolpo Sherab Sanggye" means European Wisdom Buddha. Tibetans favour the word "western" because they can't say "european".

Even not knowing Tibetan, I think you are mistaken. "Dolpo" is the name of a region in Nepal where he was born. Many Tibetans are called by the name of their birth region. His biographies say he was born in that region of Nepal; so unless you think Nepal is part of Europe or that an expatriate group of europeans were living in Nepal in the 1290s I do not think your speculation is correct.

[mutsuk]

Aemilius,

Will is perfectly right. Dolpo is a tibetan speaking region of North-western Nepal. Dolpopa means "the one from Dolpo", or "the one born in Dolpo".

[Aemilius]

Dolpo in Nepal/Tibet is similar to the places like New Wales, New York, Nova Scotia etc in United States/Canada. There is also the original Dolpo, the original Europe.
That Dolpo is actually in Nepal is told to simple people so that they don't have to travel very far (to reach the real Europe/Dolpo). This same thing has been done in many countries of our world (in regard to different important & holy locations).

[conebeckham]

You're wrong-Dolpopa had nothing to do with Europe. the REAL Dolpo is in present-day Nepal region. By your (specious) reasoning, the "Dolpo" in Nepal would be called New Dolpo.

And there are examples of dipthongs in Tibetan--sometimes they are proounced as elided vowel-sounds, and sometimes not. Best example would be the grammatical marker "ah-chung Gigu" affixed after final vowels "ah" --these are sometimes pronounced as something like "ah-ee." Sometimes just "ay."

Dolpopa Sherab Gyaltsen was not European. What, by the way, is the word for "Europe" that you seem to think equates with Dolpo?

[conebeckham]

..and, while we're at it, are you proposing that New York, New Wales, and Nova Scotia ("New Scotland") are somehow "stand-ins" for their "originals," or are meant to deceive people who really want to go to York, even though they don't know it?

[Aemilius]

I have heard enough of tibetan pronounciation of european words of european languages, so that "dolpo" seems and sounds just like a very normal tibetan version of it.

You're wrong-Dolpopa had nothing to do with Europe. the REAL Dolpo is in present-day Nepal region. By your (specious) reasoning, the "Dolpo" in Nepal would be called New Dolpo.

And there are examples of dipthongs in Tibetan--sometimes they are proounced as elided vowel-sounds, and sometimes not. Best example would be the grammatical marker "ah-chung Gigu" affixed after final vowels "ah" --these are sometimes pronounced as something like "ah-ee." Sometimes just "ay."

Dolpopa Sherab Gyaltsen was not European. What, by the way, is the word for "Europe" that you seem to think equates with Dolpo?

[conebeckham]

What is this "it" that Dolpo sounds like, specifically?

Are you saying that, in general, the word "Dolpo" sounds like a European word? And that, therefore, Dolpo must be Europe. Forgive me, I'm having a hard time following you here......

[Aemilius]

What is this "it" that Dolpo sounds like, specifically?

"Dolpo" sounds like a tibetan version of the word "europe", clear now ?
Jäschke analyses briefly in the introduction of his dictionary different tibetan dialects and how they pronounce words beginning with vowels, sure enough there is a case in which initial vowel becomes d + initial vowel.

[conebeckham]

Well, the Tibetans I hang out with have no problem saying "Europe." Without a "D" sound at the beginning. Some of them don't speak much English either.

In any case, I'm quite sure Dolpopa was from Dolpo, In present-day Nepal, and was not European.

You are free to speculate howsoever you desire, though.

[Aemilius]

Well, the Tibetans I hang out with have no problem saying "Europe." Without a "D" sound at the beginning. Some of them don't speak much English either.

In any case, I'm quite sure Dolpopa was from Dolpo, In present-day Nepal, and was not European.

You are free to speculate howsoever you desire, though.

They are probably young, and have trained themselves specifically for that purpose. Time has passed, and it helps somewhat, some of the tibetans learn gradually foreign languages. But there are some (tibetans) who never learn foreign tongues. You are making a false conclusion.

[conebeckham]

I may be making a false or incorrect conclusion based on my evidence.

But you are certainly speculating, well outside the realm of the reasonable, in thinking Dolpopa was from Europe. Talk to Cyrus Stearns, or Gene Smith....or any Lama familiar with Dolpopa Sherab Gyaltsen's work and history.

I will leave the discussion, as I have nothing more to contribute.

[Dhondrub]

You know, I recently found out that Milarepa was actually from Milano, Italy. There he was known as the reaper(for he killed 37 of his relatives using black magic),but Tibetans just couldnt pronounce it, hence the milanese reaper became Milarepa.

[mutsuk]

You know, I recently found out that Milarepa was actually from Milano, Italy. There he was known as the reaper(for he killed 37 of his relatives using black magic),but Tibetans just couldnt pronounce it, hence the milanese reaper became Milarepa.

I knew there was some mafia behind that, Dhondrub!

Aemilius, your statements are deluded. Dolpo is a region of Western Nepal. It is well-known. Dolpopa was not an european. You could at least read his biography in English this would avoid all this nonsense you are talking about.

[Aemilius]

You know, I recently found out that Milarepa was actually from Milano, Italy. There he was known as the reaper(for he killed 37 of his relatives using black magic),but Tibetans just couldnt pronounce it, hence the milanese reaper became Milarepa.

I knew there was some mafia behind that, Dhondrub!

Aemilius, your statements are deluded. Dolpo is a region of Western Nepal. It is well-known. Dolpopa was not an european. You could at least read his biography in English this would avoid all this nonsense you are talking about.

It is not wise to assume that anything written in history books is factually true.
There is strong evidence for the contrary, i.e. that writing history is a valuable tool for any state, for all kinds of national interests.
I don't wish to contradict your faith, in case you have real and genuine faith in Lama Dolpopa.

[mutsuk]

It is not wise to assume that anything written in history books is factually true.
There is strong evidence for the contrary, i.e. that writing history is a valuable tool for any state, for all kinds of national interests.
I don't wish to contradict your faith, in case you have real and genuine faith in Lama Dolpopa.

This is not the problem. The problem is : your assumption about Dolpopa is based on a wrong and nonsensical elaboration of your mind. Please take the time to read the book by C. Stearns. This will greatly help you understand your mistake and will avoid all that waste of time.