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Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga - Page 4 - Dhamma Wheel

Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
morning mist
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby morning mist » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:12 pm

with metta,

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mikenz66
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby mikenz66 » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:14 pm


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daverupa
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby daverupa » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:26 pm


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Prasadachitta
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby Prasadachitta » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:37 pm

"Beautifully taught is the Lord's Dhamma, immediately apparent, timeless, of the nature of a personal invitation, progressive, to be attained by the wise, each for himself." Anguttara Nikaya V.332

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mikenz66
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby mikenz66 » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:40 pm


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cooran
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby cooran » Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:06 pm

Hello Mike, all,

You are correct - 'faith' doesn't mean 'blind faith' - it means 'this much I have shown to be true, therefore I have confidence that as practice deepens, so will more of the Buddha's teachings be shown to be correct' .

This might be of interest:

Faith In The Buddha’s Teaching by Soma Thera

''………… It must be clearly understood that this saddha (confidence), born of knowledge, is essentially different from the Hindu “bhakti” or Christian “faith” since there is no element of a purely emotional affection or any personal relationship or blind credulity. ………….''
http://www.bps.lk/olib/wh/wh262-p.html

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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daverupa
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby daverupa » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:41 am

"To take on faith" is an idiom that is not explained by recourse to saddha; the idiom means something else, and conflating English with Pali is going to generate confusion. Furthermore, inference operates according to rules of logic which is a far cry from using it euphemistically in order to "make it sound more rational". Seeing as how I am being thoroughly misunderstood, I withdraw.

:heart:

Haniver
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby Haniver » Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:01 am

Want to hear a crazy thought? Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mind_uploading
If this was possible, which is supposedly going to be, you could scan the brain of a meditator who had attained the supernormal knowledge of former lives, and prove, without a doubt, that rebirth indeed exists.
Last edited by Haniver on Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:11 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Ben
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby Ben » Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:03 am

Oh dear!
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

PeterB
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby PeterB » Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:28 am


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mikenz66
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby mikenz66 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 11:09 am


Haniver
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby Haniver » Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:10 am


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daverupa
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby daverupa » Sun Sep 04, 2011 3:56 pm


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mikenz66
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby mikenz66 » Sun Sep 04, 2011 7:26 pm


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daverupa
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby daverupa » Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:44 pm


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mikenz66
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby mikenz66 » Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:59 pm


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mikenz66
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby mikenz66 » Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:10 pm


Nicro
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby Nicro » Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:00 pm

There are somethings in the Dhamma that have to be taken on "faith".

The best way I've heard this was put like this:

So I have never been to Australia. But, lets say I meet someone who lives there. They tell me about Australia. They also tell me about there trip to Oregon. I have been to Oregon and know what its like, and there description matches mine. Therefore due to the fact that I can verify they know what they are talking about, along with there accent and seeming knowledge of Australia, its fair for me to believe they are from Australia.

In the same way I am not enlightened nor do I have knowledge of past lives. But, I can verify that the Buddha knew what he was talking about in terms of Dukkha, Annica, and Annata. I can also see the truth of the Four Noble Truths, and the Noble 8 Fold Path. The more I practice this path, the more obvious the truth of the Buddha becomes. Therefore, I have no problems believing what the Buddha has to say about Nibbana or rebirth.

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DarwidHalim
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby DarwidHalim » Mon Sep 19, 2011 4:47 am

I am not here nor there.
I am not right nor wrong.
I do not exist neither non-exist.
I am not I nor non-I.
I am not in samsara nor nirvana.
To All Buddhas, I bow down for the teaching of emptiness. Thank You!

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daverupa
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Re: Doubts on rebirth and the Visuddhimagga

Postby daverupa » Mon Sep 19, 2011 10:37 pm



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