Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

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Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby TaTa » Sun Dec 30, 2012 5:38 pm

I'm analyzing the possibility of going to a goenka retreat although im really interested in tibetan buddhism. I would like to know how i would response to a retreat like that and im thinking that maybe it would be a nice base before going into more "complex" vajrayana practices. What do you think fellow practitioners?
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:41 pm

:twothumbsup: Goenka retreats are fantastic. I have a fellow vajra brother in the Kagyu tradition that also "leads" Goenka retreats and has taught Goenka Vipassana at Kagyu centres.

Now the only problem is if you have samaya for practices, but even then... it is not as if you will be leaving the practices to engage in sex, drugs and rock'n'roll (and there's always Vajrasattva practice and 35 Confession Buddha practices to make up for the samaya breakages).
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby TaTa » Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:33 pm

The only samaya i have is to recite sangye menla's mantra 7 times a day. Does it count if i do it mentaly? Or maybe i can break the silence in the reatret for that porpuse only hehe
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby Konchog1 » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:05 pm

gregkavarnos wrote: the only problem is if you have samaya for practices (and there's always Vajrasattva practice and 35 Confession Buddha practices to make up for the samaya breakages).
:namaste:
Preforming wrong actions and then confessing them and so forth is like drinking poison and then drinking the antidote.

"Since you greatly extend the time needed to attain such things as knowledge of the path, strive not to be tarnished by faults from the start. The Buddha said that for this reason noble beings do not consciously engage in even the subtlest of sins or infractions, even for the sake of their own lives. If it was the case that purity through confession was similar to faults that have never taken place, then there would be no need to act in this way."
-Lam Rim Chen Mo eng v01 pg. 257 tib pg 201
Equanimity is the ground. Love is the moisture. Compassion is the seed. Bodhicitta is the result.

-Paraphrase of Khensur Rinpoche Lobsang Tsephel citing the Guhyasamaja Tantra

"All memories and thoughts are the union of emptiness and knowing, the Mind.
Without attachment, self-liberating, like a snake in a knot.
Through the qualities of meditating in that way,
Mental obscurations are purified and the dharmakaya is attained."

-Ra Lotsawa, All-pervading Melodious Drumbeats
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby deepbluehum » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:08 pm

Take a look at Bhante Madawela Punnaji for a system that more resembles Kagyu mahamudra.
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:17 pm

Konchog1 wrote:Preforming wrong actions and then confessing them and so forth is like drinking poison and then drinking the antidote.

"Since you greatly extend the time needed to attain such things as knowledge of the path, strive not to be tarnished by faults from the start. The Buddha said that for this reason noble beings do not consciously engage in even the subtlest of sins or infractions, even for the sake of their own lives. If it was the case that purity through confession was similar to faults that have never taken place, then there would be no need to act in this way."
-Lam Rim Chen Mo eng v01 pg. 257 tib pg 201
Doing a 24 hour per day Vipassana retreat instead of seven Medicine Buddha mantras a day is wrong action??? Chill out dude! I am sure that if they talk to the lama that gave them the samaya, that they will be quite happy for TaTa to "make up" for the whole 7 mantra a day that they "missed out" on during the course of the retreat. I'm also sure that Sangye Menla won't mind that TaTa spent 10 days practicing like a lunatic in order to better benefit sentient beings.

Vows are taken to affect ones mind stream in a positive manner, if the vow is "broken" for a greater positive effect then the intention behind the vow has not been broken. ie no infraction. Vows are not about guilt trips. Chill out!
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby deepbluehum » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:18 pm

If you engage in Theravada methods with a Mahayana attitude, it is not Hinayana.
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby Konchog1 » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:48 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:
Konchog1 wrote:Preforming wrong actions and then confessing them and so forth is like drinking poison and then drinking the antidote.

"Since you greatly extend the time needed to attain such things as knowledge of the path, strive not to be tarnished by faults from the start. The Buddha said that for this reason noble beings do not consciously engage in even the subtlest of sins or infractions, even for the sake of their own lives. If it was the case that purity through confession was similar to faults that have never taken place, then there would be no need to act in this way."
-Lam Rim Chen Mo eng v01 pg. 257 tib pg 201
Doing a 24 hour per day Vipassana retreat instead of seven Medicine Buddha mantras a day is wrong action??? Chill out dude! I am sure that if they talk to the lama that gave them the samaya, that they will be quite happy for TaTa to "make up" for the whole 7 mantra a day that they "missed out" on during the course of the retreat. I'm also sure that Sangye Menla won't mind that TaTa spent 10 days practicing like a lunatic in order to better benefit sentient beings.

Vows are taken to affect ones mind stream in a positive manner, if the vow is "broken" for a greater positive effect then the intention behind the vow has not been broken. ie no infraction. Vows are not about guilt trips. Chill out!
:namaste:
When did I ever mention Vipassana retreats? My objection was to your assertion that wrong actions can be preformed because one can simply practice the four powers afterwards. My understanding is that that is not a correct view.
Equanimity is the ground. Love is the moisture. Compassion is the seed. Bodhicitta is the result.

-Paraphrase of Khensur Rinpoche Lobsang Tsephel citing the Guhyasamaja Tantra

"All memories and thoughts are the union of emptiness and knowing, the Mind.
Without attachment, self-liberating, like a snake in a knot.
Through the qualities of meditating in that way,
Mental obscurations are purified and the dharmakaya is attained."

-Ra Lotsawa, All-pervading Melodious Drumbeats
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sun Dec 30, 2012 10:32 pm

Yes, well, maybe you gotta look at peoples comments within the context of the discussion before running off on tangents!? :tongue:
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Sherab Dorje
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby plwk » Mon Dec 31, 2012 2:05 am

What does your teacher think, TaTa, if you have one?
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby TaTa » Mon Dec 31, 2012 5:37 pm

plwk wrote:What does your teacher think, TaTa, if you have one?


I do but unfortunately i wont be able to see him for a couple of months because he went on reatreat and the activites in my local center are suspended in summer, and i also go on a 1 or 2 month trips now. (here in buenos aires in january nobody is left in the city =P ) so i wont be able to talk to him about this. Although i consider him my teacher i have only went to this kagyu center for a couple of months so maybe he wont mind hehe. i dont really know!
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby Simon E. » Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:19 am

I did a Vipassana retreat while a student of Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche..in fact he sent a whole bunch of us to do several.
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Re: Doing a goenka retreat while beeing a kagyu student?

Postby jhonsmith » Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:08 am

Take a look at Bhante Madawela Punnaji for a system that more resembles Kagyu mahamudra. Theravada methods with a Mahayana attitude,,,....!!!

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