Dharma Wheel

A Buddhist discussion forum on Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism
It is currently Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:16 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 21 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
Hi, can anyone recommend any books on deity yoga that are fairly easy to comprehend?
Thanks,
Lise


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm
Posts: 1601
I am not answering the question and I may not even be Buddhist....

but I advocate strongly on not engageing this thing until a foundation in prelimary practice to include a firm foundation in lack of inherant existance and the causual relationship of things be firstly successfully completed.

One may individually already done so, I don't know. If one has, one generally is in a environment and subsequent to the latter issues must already have a good idea on the sources for such written materials. A lama typically directs such practice and preliminary practice and thusly one may be directed best by such a person, to include written materials, with few exceptions(but not to deny some exceptions).

Snow lion's publication can be useful and their sales staff are very helpful in specifics such as this however, if one already is well founded and completed, and is the exception. You can get it by ordering a item or just asking usually.

I just mentioned this in another thread and as there exists no coincidences....I figured I may best mention it here.

_________________
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:14 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
Hi ronne, I am not sure if you are addressing me directly. While I consider myself a relative beginner, I am not a newbie to Buddhism and do have a solid foundation to my practice. I like to read at the same time as I do my regular and new meditations. Study is a major part of my daily practice.
:namaste:
Lise


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:31 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:04 pm
Posts: 5771
Hi Lise,

You will likely find Lama Yeshe's book Introduction to Tantra useful. It's accessible and informative. Another good place to start might be Gates to Buddhist Practice by Chagdud Tulku.

Hope that helps.

Jikan

_________________
Need help getting on retreat? Want to support others in practice? Pay the Dana for Dharma forum a visit...

viewtopic.php?f=114&t=13727


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:35 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:49 pm
Posts: 2808
Location: Bay Area, CA, USA
Bokar Rinpoche's book, Chenrezig, Lord of Love is a great little book about that practice specifically, and deity yoga, in general.

Gyaltrul Rinpoche's Generating the Deity, I think it's called, is really good, too...I think it goes by a different name.

Slightly more advanced, but dealing with deity yoga, is Creation and Completion translated by Sarah Harding, from Jamgon Kongtrul's original Tibetan. Gives a great, pithy summary of deity yoga.

_________________
May any merit generated by on-line discussion
Be dedicated to the Ultimate Benefit of All Sentient Beings.


Last edited by conebeckham on Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm
Posts: 1601
LH

I am not necessarily addressing you as I don't know you, which is why I stated this...."One may individually already done so, I don't know. If one has".


My personal experience, and judgeing from responses this differs from probably all here...is one should not generally engage in this unguided. All meditational practices are not equal.... some have little chance for error some a medium chance and some a great chance. Context....the individual and the particular circumstance of that individual determine the chance.

Diety practices to my observation require a strong foundation in particular preliminaries. Success in other aspects of meditational pursuit does not necessarily infer one has attained a success in these particular preliminaries.

We in the west are just significantly in a differing contextual circumstance than those in the east and in a religious historical context where these practices were most commonly offered.

In a formal practice session training on this issue...days and days may be spent just talking about and engageing the preliminaries depending on audience and sometimes progress beyond the preliminaries may not even be accomplished during the first week or group of meetings on this issue. In a historical context a basic foundation which included years of training in the preliminaries was engaged with only rare exception. But it was a particular foundational basis. While quite young were those advancing in the preliminaries, one cannot expect to just go into the practice without prelimary depending on age. It is a question of particular experience or circumstantial accumulation, not age or understanding naturally accumulated with age. In this a ten year old with training may excel beyond a 40 year old with no training.

So picking up a book and starting practice regardless if one has meditational experience is not to my opinion a thing to do with this specific thing.
I do not know you and cannot offer a personal recommendation. YOur comment infers you have not been offered specific prelimiaries and I would consult with a lama prior to engageing this thing in book form.

Then after that you could be the judge.

Excellent books offered by tibetan teachers on the subject to my opinion are invariably always offered within the context of one soon to engage the practice in a formal session or to complement the formal session but not designed to stand independent to the formal sessions nor preliminaries engagement.

So one could read these things in that context as a recreational reading of sorts but not be actually engageing the thing. To engage the thing would be a error to my opinion without a formal session/series of sessions really, and the guidance of lama....but we see thousands doing this.

I contend it is a error and to offer books without qualifing the response suchly is likewise a error.

Your personal circumstance suggests by other post, though as stated I do not know you and cannot offer personal advice in any manner.....a teacher and temple is available to consult on this issue. YOu may then find out if what I say it total unmitaged crap or if it bears consideration...in such place. No crap barameter is available on the internet you hear the most outrageous things and people offer things without considering consequence it seems.

_________________
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:15 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:36 am
Posts: 4027
Location: Spaceship Earth
lisehull wrote:
Hi, can anyone recommend any books on deity yoga that are fairly easy to comprehend?
Thanks,
Lise



I really like Creation and Completion: Essential Points of Tantric Meditation by Jamgon Kongtrul too

_________________
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
Thanks to those who have been helpful about suggesting books; I shall try to seek them out. :namaste:
As far as your comments ronne, I think it's unwise to infer things because the inferences themselves can be wrong.
Lise


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:49 pm
Posts: 2808
Location: Bay Area, CA, USA
You're welcome, Lise.

Bokar Rinpoche's book, in particular, is great because it not only addresses issues relating to deity yoga in general, but it contains actual instructions in Chenrezig Deity Yoga, which is a practice that one can do without empowerment, and without fear. There's a reason this practice is the "gateway" deity practice in most Karma Kagyu centers throughout the world. It's safe, and is simple while at the same time being very rich, and is also effective.

You can check Amazon for all the books I listed....there's a newer version of Gyaltrul Rinpoche's book, called "Generation Stage" or something like that.....I've thumbed through it, and it's a great book.

Another great book I just thought of, and one that lays out the various stages of Creation Stage sadhana practice--i.e., refuge, generating bodhicitta, through the various stages of purification, protection circle, generating the supporting mandala, generating the deity or deities, etc., all the way through dissolution and re-appearance, is the Light of Wisdom, Vol. II. That book, although it is specifically about a specific Guru Rinpoche practice, if I recall, provides a great general outline of the various stages of a more complex Generation Stage practice, from the Nyingma point of view. Big Sarma sadhanas may differ in some respects, but the general stages are quite similar.

There's also a book called "Deity Yoga" by HH Dalai Lama, but I don't think it would be helpful for you, unless you already have some grounding in the basics of deity yoga and tantra in general--it deals with differences in visualization practices between the various levels of Tantric practice--Kriya, Charya, etc......though perhaps that's just what you're looking for, I don't know.

_________________
May any merit generated by on-line discussion
Be dedicated to the Ultimate Benefit of All Sentient Beings.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:46 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm
Posts: 1601
LH

I would suggest you check with your lama(lineage holder under which your center operates) before stateing what I state is wrong literally or by inferal. Be advised I suggest lama and not center/temple director, as many times those are american benefactors with great hearts but not necessarily great understandings, sometimes... sometimes not.

Till then I do not stand corrected as it is only your personal opinion verses mine. If your lama states I am wrong I will accept myself as being wrong in this.

But it is plain my suggestion is not wanted....I will not post on any of your threads in the future.

Have a nice day.

_________________
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 3:04 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
Dear ronne, as my lama (and NOT temple director) is on retreat until September I have to fend for myself, hence I am asking on this forum. I don't know what you are saying we disagree on, except your inferences from my other messages. I think I am more aware of my practice than you, that is what I am saying. Please do not presume you know anything about my practice nore my interactions with the lamas at the center I attend from my few messages on this forum.
Lise :namaste:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:05 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm
Posts: 1601
Do what you want, whatever you want....I don't care.

Have a nice day.

_________________
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 10:32 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 5:44 am
Posts: 216
I might also recommend Establishing Appearances as Divine: http://www.amazon.com/Establishing-Appearances-Divine-Reasoning-Madhyamaka/dp/1559392886 if you have any philosophical interest in deity yoga.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:59 am 
Offline
Founding Member

Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:44 pm
Posts: 2230
ronnewmexico wrote:
I am not answering the question and I may not even be Buddhist....

but I advocate strongly on not engageing this thing until a foundation in prelimary practice to include a firm foundation in lack of inherant existance and the causual relationship of things be firstly successfully completed.

One may individually already done so, I don't know. If one has, one generally is in a environment and subsequent to the latter issues must already have a good idea on the sources for such written materials.

I just mentioned this in another thread and as there exists no coincidences....I figured I may best mention it here.


Hi Ron,

Lise is clearly looking for suggestions for reading materials in this thread, not practice advise. Please stay on topic. Thanks :)

Best,
Laura


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 1:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2009 1:17 pm
Posts: 317
lisehull wrote:
Hi, can anyone recommend any books on deity yoga that are fairly easy to comprehend?
Thanks,
Lise



Hi Lise,

You might also like to take a look at the book by Venerable Thubten Chodron - How to Free Your Mind.


http://www.snowlionpub.com/pages/N69_2.html

How to Free Your Mind:

........... is directed toward a general audience. One need not be a Buddhist to read it or gain something from it. If you are curious about Buddhist deities, if you want to learn how to free your mind from disturbing emotions such as clinging attachment and anger, if you wonder what the nature of reality is; if you are interested in female Buddhas, you will find something of interest in these pages.


Interview with Bhikshuni Thubten Chodron on Sadhana Practices


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:39 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
Once again, thank you for the suggestions! I have read How to Free Your Mind, and did indeed find it useful. I have ordered Creation and Completion and am looking forward to reading through that as well!
:bow:
Lise


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm
Posts: 1601
My appologies to the initial poster LH for deviating from point.

Ron

_________________
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:45 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 7:59 pm
Posts: 27
Hey,
[quote]
Bokar Rinpoche's book, in particular, is great because it not only addresses issues relating to deity yoga in general, but it contains actual instructions in Chenrezig Deity Yoga, which is a practice that one can do without empowerment, and without fear. There's a reason this practice is the "gateway" deity practice in most Karma Kagyu centers throughout the world. It's safe, and is simple while at the same time being very rich, and is also effective [quote]


It really is an excellent book and so easy to digest. The principles are explained using Chenrezig as an outline but can easily be transfered. In short, it is a great beginner's book!!!! Most recommended. Also, his Tara book is very good too.

:applause:

Is a damn shame he is dead (Bokar Rinpoche). I was near his old monastery in West Bengal earlier this year. If he had been there I would love to have had met him.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:36 am
Posts: 4027
Location: Spaceship Earth
lisehull wrote:
Once again, thank you for the suggestions! I have read How to Free Your Mind, and did indeed find it useful. I have ordered Creation and Completion and am looking forward to reading through that as well!
:bow:
Lise


I read Creation and Completion probably about 3 times a year and always pick up something new. Thrangu Rinpoche's commentary is amazing...he has a couple of passages on anger in creation stage which blows most, if not all books away that attempt to address how best to deal with anger from a tantric perspective :smile: .

_________________
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: deity yoga
PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:14 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
I'm looking forward to reading it. It sounds like a winner!
:namaste:
Lise


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 21 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group