Dharma Wheel

A Buddhist discussion forum on Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism
It is currently Thu Dec 25, 2014 1:54 am

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:29 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:16 am
Posts: 185
Location: The Middle of Nowhere
One of the major hindrances to me is my constant clinging to "I."this has caused me some trouble and makes me rather blind in certain doctrines.How can I get rid of my constant clinging to self?

_________________
A person once asked me why I would want to stop rebirth. "It sounds pretty cool. Being able to come back. Who wouldn't want to be reborn."
I replied. "Wanting to be reborn is like wanting to stay in a jail cell, when you have the chance to go free and experience the whole wide world. Does a convict, on being freed from his shabby, constricting, little cell, suddenly say "I really want to go back to jail and be put in a cell. It sounds pretty cool. Being able to come back. Who wouldn't want that?"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:55 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:58 pm
Posts: 1106
The same way you get to Carnegie Hall: practice, practice, practice.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:04 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:58 am
Posts: 993
Think about what happens when you identify with something, for example when you say I am this or that, you are excluding the other possibilities and anchoring yourself to something partial rather than remaining open to the whole.

_________________
we cannot get rid of God because we still believe in grammar - Nietzsche


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:11 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2010 3:10 pm
Posts: 805
Reciting and contemplation of the Heart Sutra is often a very efficient practice for piercing ego, among other things. In East Asia, due to its relative short length, practitioners would memorize it and recite it continuously.

_________________
If you believe certain words, you believe their hidden arguments. When you believe something is right or wrong, true of false, you believe the assumptions in the words which express the arguments. Such assumptions are often full of holes, but remain most precious to the convinced.

- The Open-Ended Proof from The Panoplia Prophetica


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:38 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:59 am
Posts: 3044
To know that we all are perfect nature already and there is a temporary misperception (duality) can be encouraging.

There is no wrong one, but mispercieving suffering.
May no suffer be.

Yes, Jnana, practice, thank you.

:namaste:

_________________
There is only nature and all is nature. Any discrimination is ones’ own delusion.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:54 am 
Offline
Former staff member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:22 pm
Posts: 4203
Location: Budapest
The Buddha's basic remedy is the contemplation on the five aggregates and the 6-12-18 sensory fields. To see that whatever you call the I must be an aggregate, and all aggregates bear the three characteristics (impermanent, suffering, selfless) results in comprehending and even realising that there is no such thing as an I.

_________________
"There is no such thing as the real mind. Ridding yourself of delusion: that's the real mind."
(Sheng-yen: Getting the Buddha Mind, p 73)

"Neither cultivation nor seated meditation — this is the pure Chan of Tathagata."
(Mazu Daoyi, X1321p3b23; tr. Jinhua Jia)

“Don’t rashly seek the true Buddha;
True Buddha can’t be found.
Does marvelous nature and spirit
Need tempering or refinement?
Mind is this mind carefree;
This face, the face at birth."

(Nanyue Mingzan: Enjoying the Way, tr. Jeff Shore; T2076p461b24-26)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:35 pm 
Online
Global Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Posts: 3045
Location: Olympia WA
Two things that help me some, old hat for many i'm sure.

First I just ask "who am I", and name five things that define me, then follow these five things to their conclusion, and I see there is no "I" found in them, whatever I name will only be relationships to something else.

Sometimes when meditating I focus on physical pain I am feeling (don't know why pain is easier than anything else), and try to inquire into the pain and follow it to it's root...if/when i've been successful I can sort of "see" that the pain is not a thing but the working of the aggregates.

_________________
"We're chained to the world and we all gotta pull" -Tom Waits


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:03 am
Posts: 933
Johny Dangerous, Who am I?... is the ultimate question. It is stated in many different ways that the focus should be the origin of the I and to literally follow the thoughts back to their source and abide there right at that point of origin. Nisargadatta also points to this placeless place as just prior to the rise of the thought. Others even say I is the first name of God and holding the "I" can be a mantra which reminds one strongly of the diamond cutter sutra...a honing of all thoughts down to just the first principle. All that said, the point is the origin and directing the attention there as it wanders again and again. I really don't think there is one specific method for everyone. Don't all stances go in the end?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:08 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:50 pm
Posts: 732
Location: South Florida, USA
Insight meditation practice I would think. :smile:

_________________
One should not kill any living being, nor cause it to be killed, nor should one incite any other to kill. Do never injure any being, whether strong or weak, in this entire universe!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:23 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 3:29 pm
Posts: 172
Jnana wrote:
The same way you get to Carnegie Hall: practice, practice, practice.


Second vote.

Persistence, inquiry and doubt.

_________________
Floating Bo


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:29 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:16 am
Posts: 185
Location: The Middle of Nowhere
How exactly is the concept of I an illusion?I can understand that there is no self set in stone but there is still technically a being called Red Faced Buddha.My major problem is my fear of impermanence and anatman.

_________________
A person once asked me why I would want to stop rebirth. "It sounds pretty cool. Being able to come back. Who wouldn't want to be reborn."
I replied. "Wanting to be reborn is like wanting to stay in a jail cell, when you have the chance to go free and experience the whole wide world. Does a convict, on being freed from his shabby, constricting, little cell, suddenly say "I really want to go back to jail and be put in a cell. It sounds pretty cool. Being able to come back. Who wouldn't want that?"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:58 am
Posts: 993
Red Faced Buddha wrote:
How exactly is the concept of I an illusion?I can understand that there is no self set in stone but there is still technically a being called Red Faced Buddha.My major problem is my fear of impermanence and anatman.


Just to clarify, are you asking about personal identity here, or about the ontological status of awareness?

_________________
we cannot get rid of God because we still believe in grammar - Nietzsche


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:34 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2012 7:11 am
Posts: 614
Location: Oregon
Red Faced Buddha wrote:
How exactly is the concept of I an illusion?I can understand that there is no self set in stone but there is still technically a being called Red Faced Buddha.My major problem is my fear of impermanence and anatman.

Well, what is a being then? What is YOUR being? Follow the question to its most absurd lengths. The point isn't to prove some nihilist brainteaser "none of us really exists!"

Where you may arrive though is the apparent realization of nothing seeming to exist independently with clear-cut borders, nothing seeming to have a man behind the curtain calling the shots. And yet here you are. Paradoxes are good at stopping our minds, especially when we have a sense that it's not a paradox at all. Welcome to the absurdity of our normal views! :D Our natural state seems supremely bizarre if you look too close :P

_________________
Namu Amida Butsu


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm
Posts: 490
Johnny Dangerous wrote:
"who am I"


The Eternal Question...

From one of the greatest movies of all time (IMHO)

http://youtu.be/THRB4bv1-mw


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm
Posts: 490
duckfiasco wrote:
Red Faced Buddha wrote:
How exactly is the concept of I an illusion?I can understand that there is no self set in stone but there is still technically a being called Red Faced Buddha.My major problem is my fear of impermanence and anatman.

Well, what is a being then? What is YOUR being? Follow the question to its most absurd lengths. The point isn't to prove some nihilist brainteaser "none of us really exists!"

Where you may arrive though is the apparent realization of nothing seeming to exist independently with clear-cut borders, nothing seeming to have a man behind the curtain calling the shots. And yet here you are. Paradoxes are good at stopping our minds, especially when we have a sense that it's not a paradox at all. Welcome to the absurdity of our normal views! :D Our natural state seems supremely bizarre if you look too close :P

:good:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:39 pm 
Online
Global Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Posts: 3045
Location: Olympia WA
Just thinking about this, not to long ago I read A Profound Mind by HHDL.

The bits of emptiness/not self are especially good, and really gave me an understanding I did not have before, in pretty clear language. Something to work with in meditation made clearer.

I hate to do something as banal as recommending a book, but maybe it's worth it.

If you are able to successfully pall apart "I" and see that really there is no such thing, you can also do it outside of "I" with anything, and eventually see that "I" is just a set pf dependencies...

_________________
"We're chained to the world and we all gotta pull" -Tom Waits


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 3:29 pm
Posts: 172
Red Faced Buddha wrote:
How exactly is the concept of I an illusion?I can understand that there is no self set in stone but there is still technically a being called Red Faced Buddha.My major problem is my fear of impermanence and anatman.


These questions are common for a beginner.

Practice furthers. Practice can give you answers that no-one on a forum can adequately give.

When you know, then as the Buddha said, it is like tasting the fruit for yourself. Would you want anything less?

Best wishes,

Abu

_________________
Floating Bo


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 3:29 pm
Posts: 172
Johnny Dangerous wrote:
Just thinking about this, not to long ago I read A Profound Mind by HHDL.

The bits of emptiness/not self are especially good, and really gave me an understanding I did not have before, in pretty clear language. Something to work with in meditation made clearer.

I hate to do something as banal as recommending a book, but maybe it's worth it.

If you are able to successfully pall apart "I" and see that really there is no such thing, you can also do it outside of "I" with anything, and eventually see that "I" is just a set pf dependencies...


If it's an 'understanding', it will never be good enough.

Metta,

Abu

_________________
Floating Bo


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:10 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 5:22 pm
Posts: 418
Location: East Coast of Canada
The Noble Eightfold Path.

Getting rid of clinging to self is what the Dharma is all about.

Om mani padme hum
Keith


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:17 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:17 pm
Posts: 891
Doing some intro to Mahamudra meditation today...
One of the practices was an exercise on expanding your consciousness, out of the body, infinitely all around, as if an expanding sphere of awareness.
Have hit moments in meditation before, but today was pretty poignant.
I started getting almost a panic attack - felt like i had to keep breathing, had to keep my heart breathing.
Realized that maybe this was the clinging to self at a very basic level.
I still have things i need to do in this life, like taking care of my kid(s), etc.
Will keep practicing, but don't know if that lesson will be absorbed until some of my responsibilities are not so immediate.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: pemachophel and 16 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group