Tummo

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Tummo

Postby wexell » Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:52 pm

A simple question is Tummo practiced in everyday secular life?
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Re: Tummo

Postby Mr. G » Tue Aug 17, 2010 3:25 pm

Hi wexell,

I'm not sure I understand. If you mean that if one has received a teaching where tummo is included, then yes, it is included in one's daily practice if the comittments were made.
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    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
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Re: Tummo

Postby conebeckham » Tue Aug 17, 2010 4:45 pm

Can it be done in secular life? I assume you mean something like "can people do Tummo in the morning, during their morning session, and then go to the office to do their job, etc.??"
Well....yes, it can....but successfully? Not likely.
:smile:
Seriously, though.....Tummo is a retreat practice. Actually, there are different "tummo practices" though they're all based on similar foundations and techniques. There's a reason why it's normally taught in retreat...first, one needs the preliminaries to lay the groundwork--this includes deity yoga as well as ngondro, etc. Tummo is profound practice, and it requires a certain "outlook" that would be hard to attain and/or maintain with the distractions of daily life.

But I think that once someone has actually "actualized" tummo--practiced it to the point that one has experienced it, let's say--it may be possible to carry through in what you call "secular" life, which I take to mean "outside of a strict retreat."
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Re: Tummo

Postby wexell » Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:02 pm

mr. gordo yes that's exactly what I meant sorry about my english... thank you!
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Re: Tummo

Postby Mr. G » Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:45 pm

Your welcome...and I think cone makes a very good point as well. I know many people go to a major teaching and empowerment, and tummo is taught at a cursory level. But to really practice it, one should work with a teacher that has done retreat time to confirm they are doing correctly as not to hurt oneself.
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu
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Re: Tummo

Postby wexell » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:07 am

thank you so much!!! :) :twothumbsup:
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Re: Tummo

Postby davyji » Sat Sep 25, 2010 4:21 pm

Hi wexell and all, i practice tummo daily, have a regular job,family,home etc. the practice is effective and has been developed over a decade beginning with the practical aspects of swara yoga illustrated by Indian Yogis beginning with the dharanas from SriVijnanaBhairavaTantras illustrating the manifested nature of prana and apana to the Tibetan Buddhist Yoga practices of jamlung/barlung as introduced and taught to me by GTWR.

Simple hathayogas can be practiced using gentle breath retention (kumbhaka/barlung) without any fear of hurting yourself.
A good hathayoga teacher or lama teaching tsalung can introduce students to the practices, but agree if wanting to advance into draklung via tsalung and advancing to yantrayoga it is recommended with a qualified teacher of yantra since with draklung there is alot of force and deep long breath retention, is something to build up to and not to be practiced casually.

Yet simple nine breath pranayama and simple asana/tsal lung then kumbhaka/barlung with gentle breath retention is quite common among Indian Yoga practitioners yet not so common in Tibetan Buddhism and can easily be integrated into ordinary life efficiently,effectively and safely from my experience.

As a long time hathayoga practitioner and instructor a common observance is that students do not know what to do with the practices beyond the movement. Indian Kundalini/Kriya Yogas and Tibetan Buddhist Yantra/Tummo explain the deeper experience of these practices, allowing the practitioner to consciously work with the movement of energy,
pranavayu/tsalung culminating in the generation of pranashakti/kundalini/tigle. I feel too many people go through the motions and get little out of it, not only in general Indian Yoga,but in Buddhism where practitioners play down the importance of simple tantric practice as if the mind and body are separate entities and go for higher practices like togal and other practices that are generally completed only in retreat.

I disagree that simple,gentle tummo is only accomplished in retreat, yet do agree that a long term committment to practice is required and is learned by attending sessions with a qualified teacher which can be accomplished even via webcast.
The problem I have is only a few people talk about tummo (as if it were something we do but don't talk about like masturbation). By visiting the lessons from GTWR often & discussions with a few brave friends, tummo is possible as the result of simple hatha/yantra yoga practice and feel everyone should be exploring themselves deeply!! Hahahahahaha
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Re: Tummo

Postby Luke » Sat Sep 25, 2010 6:51 pm

I'm not qualified to comment on tummo techniques, but I will say that if one is Buddhist, it's important to approach any meditation technique from the standpoint of using it to develop the wisdom and compassion which help one attain enlightenment in order to benefit all beings.

If one simply collects meditation techniques like they're some kind of internal gymnastics practices without any altruistic motivation, then they are pointless from the Buddhist point of view and will not lead to full enlightenment.

In Vajrayana, bodhichitta and devotion to one's lama are paramount in all situations. And one should always dedicate the merits of one's practices for the benefit of all beings. The more one learns, the more one realizes how each opportunity to benefit another being is an incredibly special moment.

The greatest lamas who know all the advanced meditation techniques always emphasize bodhichitta before anything else.

I would also think that a person should have completed or at the very least started ngondro before learning tummo.
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Re: Tummo

Postby catmoon » Sat Sep 25, 2010 7:22 pm

My experience has been that yes, one can practice tummo in a secular way and even obtain some results, like producing a little heat or cold, but of course such practice is secular, which means it lacks the spiritual dimension, which means it also lacks the spiritual benefits.

Without teachers it is quite difficult to obtain even small effects. The methods adopted tend to be inefficient and thus tummo is reduced to little more than a curiosity, a roadside attraction on the path. With teachers... well I wouldn't know about that now, would I?
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Re: Tummo

Postby davyji » Sat Sep 25, 2010 9:53 pm

I agree Luke the preliminary practices are not ignored/nor given up and there are plenty of preliminary practices to be used before learning and while practicing tummo.

And agreed cat, the biggest problem i've observed with hathayoga is students going through the motions, this is where a good teacher can introduce a deeper/more conscious experience combining asana/pranayama/bandhas/dristi as foundational practices for more successful meditations.
If you are saying that the Indian Yoga traditions, for example the Bihar School of Yoga among others,
are just a bunch of techniques with no spiritual basis, you are expressing a limited view.


What I am saying is that if one wants to learn tummo then learn hatha/yantrayoga (in Tibetan;TrulKhor/TsaLung), the basics plus the awakening of pranashakti is all there,
is a good start to familarize oneself with the basic terminology,physiology and actual beneficial practices.
Then the student may be prepared when a teacher comes along teaching tsalung/yantra/tummo to get the most out of the retreat or seminar, taking some of the mystery out of it and one can focus on the secret inner aspects more maturely
with one's teacher and carry this with them.

Dave
Last edited by davyji on Sat Oct 02, 2010 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tummo

Postby catmoon » Sun Sep 26, 2010 12:38 am

Eeeeeks no no I was saying that the practice will lack spiritual benefit if done with out a teacher, and it won't produce much in the way of results either. I messed around with it a bit, learned to warm up or cool down a little bit, and it had all the spiritual benefit of learning to use a thermostat.

Without a teacher that's what happens - small results.
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Re: Tummo

Postby Luke » Sun Sep 26, 2010 11:23 am

Yeah, I get what you're saying Dave: hatha yoga prepares the body and its channels for tummo just like Ngondro prepares the mind for tummo. That sounds reasonable, and I've heard some Tibetan lamas talk about the benefits of hatha yoga practice.
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