You will find on one here nor pretty much anywhere that states abortion is a good thing.
That just is not being stated by anyone, check the posts....
I will not deny Hsuan Hua was a great teacher and master but his words are his words and they state as will quotes and You-Bin Chen states... the Buddha states..."If one deliberately has an abortion and the fetus dies, one commits 'an offense that cannot be repented of.'"
That is pretty unequivocal. Others in Buddhism state otherwise. Who is wrong or right.....that is a personal decision.
The subject of this thread(the quote), combined with the title..no killing...makes a statement. That statement is.....this is prohibited in Buddhism.....Yes, I take exception to that statement and verse argument opposeing.
It's certainly fine to hold view personally, to combine personal view with lineage holders opinion on that thing and post such not in a place only for lineage holders of Chan but in a general Mahayana place....that may be opposed in general Mahayana contexts...which it is.
If this is moved to Chan view holders only place....I withdraw all comments. Till then I remain with opposition.
Ron, please do not find this to be offensive, but I haven't have a clue on what you are saying. Sorry I'm not clearly understanding what you are trying to say, if you agree with my post or disagree or something else? But I will try to reply either way.
My post was to generally stating my opinion, and it wasn't specifically directed to anyone at all. And as a Mahayana Buddhist, specifically, Chan Buddhist, I tend to have a more liberal stance on this, but this is not true for all Chan Buddhist.
Concerning Ven. Master Hsuan Hua, he has his opinion on certain issue as well such as this but it is totally up to you to accept it or not. Sometimes his views are more conservative and traditional because it might had been directed to a group of people of different time so therefore it was more appropriate to take a conservative approach but then I will not argue on such point because it doesn't matter to me. I am sure that his intention was for the benefits of others like all other masters. But different masters have different ideas and opinions on things.
Right or wrong sometimes are conditioned. Like I had stated, there are many factors that are involved so it is not easy to just say "that is wrong" or "That is right" on certain things. For example, in many cultures back then, marriage between an adult man with a child or someone underage was acceptable and was seen as normal. However now in U.S., there are legal age and illegal age and sexual involvement with someone underage would be illegal, therefore a violation of the 3rd precept; Sexual Misconduct. However there are also exception.
The Buddha had stated that we are to not accept and believe things just because we read it from somewhere or was taught by a great master. We ought to reason it out with logic by ourselves as well.
It is also important to know that Buddhism is not a dogmatic religion, therefore it is flexible and can adapt to different environment of different times without losing its true essence. Like the willow of Guan Shi Yin Pu Sa, it is unbreakable even though it is flexible, but a dry stiff branch will snap when bent. However, this is not to say everything goes and there shouldn't be no rule of conduct. This is why we must take the Middle Way.
Peace in Chan