Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

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Re: Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

Postby Sara H » Sun Nov 04, 2012 10:53 pm

Btw, how do you pronouce those?

In Gassho,

Sara H
"Life is full of suffering. AND Life is full of the Eternal
IT IS OUR CHOICE
We can stand in our shadow, and wallow in the darkness,
OR
We can turn around.
It is OUR choice." -Rev. Basil

" ...out of fear, even the good harm one another. " -Rev. Dazui MacPhillamy
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Re: Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

Postby viniketa » Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:54 am

Thus, jianxing was the translation for dṛṣṭi-svabhāva, "view one's essential nature".


I could be wrong, but I would say that is most likely a "backward translation" from the Platform sutra...

:namaste:
If they can sever like and dislike, along with greed, anger, and delusion, regardless of their difference in nature, they will all accomplish the Buddha Path.. ~ Sutra of Complete Enlightenment
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Re: Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

Postby Jinzang » Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:13 am

The closest term to kensho in Tibetan would be rtogs pa.
Lamrim, lojong, and mahamudra are the unmistaken path.
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Re: Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

Postby dzoki » Mon Nov 05, 2012 5:10 pm

Jinzang wrote:The closest term to kensho in Tibetan would be rtogs pa.


well, there are several meanings translated as togpa (rtogs pa) in Tibetan:

Gatiḥ རྟོགས་པ་ judgment, knowledge, wisdom.
Avabodhaḥ རྟོགས་པ། ཁོང་དུ་ཆུད་པ་ judiciously perceived, fully understood; judgment, intellect
Buddhaḥ རྟོགས་པ་ a sage, a learned and wise man, the standard of supreme intelligence or wisdom, the very Intellect or judgment. [one that has understood (the truth), a sage, one fully enlightened.]

According to wikipedia:

Kenshō traditional Chinese: 見性; Japanese: 見性; literally: "see [one's] nature") is a Japanese term from the Zen tradition. Ken means "seeing," shō means "nature," "essence.

Kenshō is an initial insight or awakening, not full Buddhahood. It is to be followed by further training to deepen this insight, and learn to express it in daily life.

The term kenshō is often used interchangeably with satori, which is derived from the verb satoru, and means "comprehension; understanding".


so for kensho I would stay with ngowo tawa (ngo bo blta ba).

Satori seems more like equivalent of togpa (rtogs pa).
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Re: Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

Postby Jinzang » Thu Nov 08, 2012 2:02 am

I have often seen the term rtogs pa in the Tibetan text I am translating, but never ngo bo blta ba. If I came across it, I would translate as view (blta ba) on the nature (ngo bo) of phenomena, which I would take as either enlightened or unenlightened, depending on whether the view was correct or incorrect. View (blta ba) can be used as a synonym for realization when used in a context indicating a correct view. Of course, my Tibetan is not very good.

I've always taken kensho and satori as more or less equivalent terms, if there is a difference it eludes me.
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Re: Zen to Tibetan Dictionary? *grins*

Postby jmlee369 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:32 am

Would it be fair to equate kensho (見性) with something like stream entry, the attainment of the first bhumi, or the path of seeing?
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