Pure Land location

[zamotcr]

Can we locate Pure Land on a map or can’t we locate it geographically on the map, since it is too far from or beyond this world of ours, in this physical plane?
Or is outside this physical universe, like another plane, realm or dimension, a land that we cannot perceive or conceive through our conventional eyes or minds? Is this what beyond the Triple Realm, outside six realms and samsara means?

I know that for you all of these can sound like stupids questions, but I do really like Pure Land, but I can't get out of my head these questions

[Astus]

Your questions are perfectly valid, no need to worry about that. The first problem is that Buddhism hasn't had the modern cosmology with what people understand the universe today. It is said that Sukhavati is 10,000 buddha-lands away to the West. It basically means: far away. One buddha-land covers a great trichiliocosm (trisāhasra-mahāsāhasra-lokadhātu), which is based on the single unit of a world system with mount Meru, the continents and the six realms. This does not convert to planets, solar systems or even galaxies. But if you want to, you may think that it's 10,000 galaxies away. Or you can also say that it's a separate dimension. And while we cannot reach another buddha-land by any known vehicle, in meditation it is possible.

[Nighthawk]

I've always thought of it as a spiritual not material realm.

[Nighthawk]

Your questions are perfectly valid, no need to worry about that. The first problem is that Buddhism hasn't had the modern cosmology with what people understand the universe today. It is said that Sukhavati is 10,000 buddha-lands away to the West. It basically means: far away. One buddha-land covers a great trichiliocosm (trisāhasra-mahāsāhasra-lokadhātu), which is based on the single unit of a world system with mount Meru, the continents and the six realms. This does not convert to planets, solar systems or even galaxies. But if you want to, you may think that it's 10,000 galaxies away. Or you can also say that it's a separate dimension. And while we cannot reach another buddha-land by any known vehicle, in meditation it is possible.

What's your opinion about it? Do you see it as 10,000 galaxies away or as something in a separate dimension?

[Astus]

What's your opinion about it? Do you see it as 10,000 galaxies away or as something in a separate dimension?

If I want to use today's cosmology I say it's galaxies. Another dimension is also fine, although then the meaning of distance and direction is lost. However, direction on galactic level is also problematic. And that's why classic Buddhist cosmology doesn't translate well to modern terms.

[oldbob]

So ultimately, I think the pure land is located in your heart, and has always been there.

The Sutra references are useful for historical purposes, but looking in your heart through meditation is practical and doable, today.

Anyone who sincerely looks for it can find it. The meditation instructions are the map.

Best,

ob

[Nosta]

In my opinion, when Buddha says that Pure Land is thousands of Buddha Lands from here, means that Pure Land is a real place and is really far away from us. What He doesnt say is if "far away" belongs to our dimension or even another one. We must understand that Buddha wouldnt speak about dimensions to people that could not understand such scientific concepts.

But we must also see that probably Pure Land do not belong to our dimension or Universe. I bet that Pure Land is in a different dimension. In the other hand, Pure Land is also very near from us. Such dimension is dar away physically, but very near from you heart, as oldbob said.

[zamotcr]

For me it's dificult to accept it as located in this physical universe, you know, if that is the case, someday we could go on a spaceship, or maybe Captain Kirk could visit them with the Enterprise

[Nighthawk]

What's your opinion about it? Do you see it as 10,000 galaxies away or as something in a separate dimension?

If I want to use today's cosmology I say it's galaxies. Another dimension is also fine, although then the meaning of distance and direction is lost. However, direction on galactic level is also problematic. And that's why classic Buddhist cosmology doesn't translate well to modern terms.

Another problem is that there actually is no east, west, north, or south. Therefore we can only conclude that it is in a different dimension.

[lobster]

Check my blog for trans-dimensional warp drive, not currently available . . .
http://tmxxine.tumblr.com/post/11439943286/alcubierre-warp-drive

[zamotcr]

I hate all of my doubts Since I started with Pure Land, I don't have a time without a doubt.
Maybe I don't have self confidence, but I hate or dislike when I have to reinterpret a teaching to conform with "my mind" or the present scientific fact.
This kind of decision like if it is galaxy or dimension, white or black, etc make me loose faith :S

[Astus]

If there is analysis to be applied to the Pure Land teaching, it has to follow the teachings of the Buddha to make sense. First of all, whatever realm is experienced by a sentient being is because of its karma, its mental habits. It is not that there is some independent external world that people just fall in or go to. The external is a result and reflection of internal factors. Buddha-lands are the results of each buddhas merit accumulated and vows made through their bodhisattva path over many kalpas. Being born in a land where there is a living buddha is also a matter of karma for beings, that is, their mental status. Different lands have their own conditions for beings to get there, and that's how going to the Western Land of Amita Buddha is relatively easy compared to many other buddha-lands.

[sinweiy]

Buddha spoked that Sukhavati is 10,000 buddha-lands away to the West is from the perspective of ordinary beings who grasp time, space and physical world/material substances. to an Enlightened one who has no grasping, there's no time, space, let alone 10,000 buddha-lands away to the West. In a split second, mahasattvas can come and go what ever they like by using their mind power. check out Amitabha's Vow on "space travelling".

#9.If, when I attain Buddhahood, humans and devas in my land should not possess the supernatural power of travelling anywhere in one instant, even beyond a hundred thousand kotis of nayutas of Buddha-lands, may I not attain perfect Enlightenment.

without time/space, what's location about?

[Matt J]

I have heard it said that the Pure Land appears to the Pure Mind.

[ram peswani]

Ours is a multi diamensional universe.
Imagine on a TV screen you see only one channel to which you are tuned. And when the channel is changed, same screen shows some other programme.
Same thing happens in space. Here around you and me there are some 31 universes living at different frequencies.
And each of these frequency space is three dimensioned.