ronnewmexico wrote:Yes....500 years in a lotus leaf.
What is difficult to comprehend is why one cannot answer what has been asked, but simply prattle on as if enlightenment was a scheme of fees and payments to enter disneyland.
We do this and that and then....this occurs, we enter this fantastic place and eventually receive the ultimate gift...fulll enlightenment.
I again do not deny this as a valid path and will not repeat all I have stated, it is just too tedius, I have stated my point fairly clearly. The question remains why is it a preferred path. This ticket to enter disneyland depiction I don't see that as any valid spiritual path so described. A americanization it seems, a reading into things what may not be there. Something is there...it has not been yet described.
One sutra has been quoted and only one which seems to cotradict. Now apparently we may find others that state some semblence of what is stated(though I quite assume this semblence so far stated is a faulted one), but no mention is made of context nor to who each was spoken.
So debate or not......my ability or lack of ability to comprehend is not the issue of this debate but pure lands...why?
500 years is extremely short comparing to human beings making mistakes to fall onto the 3 evil paths and suffering in samsara for infinitely long time.
Your question had been answered many times but it is you who didn't accept it, so it is only in your mind that it isn't answer.
Why do you hold onto such view? Why do you care what other choose for their cultivation? Why do you choose the path you do? Why do you hold onto your ego? Who is holding onto these views that you believe are true?
These are the questions you should ask yourself and reflect upon and it doesn't matter what other choose for their cultivation.
The Pure Land path had been taught and encouraged by many ancient masters and patriarchs that had study both in Chan School and Pure Land School. Each school in a way have its own belief and it is for different people of different capacity.
And referring back to your first topic post. Many of us had made it clear that Pure Land of Amitabha Buddha is not the final place, nor do we have to be enlightened to be born there, even though it is possible for enlightened people to take rebirth in Pure Land because even an enlightened person needs to maintain their cultivation. It is a Buddha Land that give a more perfect condition for the beings of that land to attain enlightenment quickly without distraction and regression. Human is the only realm that give the right condition to enlightenment in Saha world, but this is not the case in Pure Land because it is not Saha world. It is definitely not a final place because to attain full enlightenment of a Buddha, one must cultivates and go through infinite amount of lives, this also consist of the Bodhisattva path and the perfecting of the paramitas, and I will make it clear, they do not practice Bodhisattva path in Pure Land. To sum it up, it is for beings who wish to attain enlightenment quickly and continue their cultivation without regression or fear of falling onto the 3 evil paths.
I think it would help if you would willingly find books and lectures by ancient or present masters, it will definitely answer your questions, but in the end it is up to you to accept it or not.
I think it is more important that you concentrate on the path of cultivation you choose that you are comfortable with and let others choose their own cultivation instead of asking this tedious and pointless question that had already been answered. You have your own reason and argument or even belief, and they have theirs.
Let go of your thoughts and views because none of it is your true intrinsic mind, all emptiness.
Peace In Chan