Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

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Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

Postby narraboth » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:29 pm

http://www.maitreyaproject.org/en/relic/calendar.html

There are buddha, indian masters and all 4 schools' great masters relics.
I personally think it's an event you can't miss.
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Re: Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

Postby White Lotus » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:58 pm

:namaste: i hope there wont be any bones. i have a hunch that using bone relics to forward a buddhist cause has in the past lead to its demise. Therevada may have something to say about this. i only spoke to a zen monk last summer and said that 'fighting' spiritually with bones will be very harmful to the buddhist cause. so lets hope there are no bones.

with concern, White Lotus.
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.
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Re: Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

Postby narraboth » Wed Jun 09, 2010 6:38 pm

don't really understand what you mean about 'buddist cause' which demised...

I think there surely will be bone, just maybe won't look like a piece of bone.
In tibetan, there are two kinds of relics after fire, the small beads called rin-sel, the hard pieces called dung. 'dung' also means bone.

Anyway, Buddha himself claimed the benefits of bowing to relics of enlightened beings in sutra and tantra. That's why people in the past use that to 'forward a buddist cause'?

White Lotus wrote::namaste: i hope there wont be any bones. i have a hunch that using bone relics to forward a buddhist cause has in the past lead to its demise. Therevada may have something to say about this. i only spoke to a zen monk last summer and said that 'fighting' spiritually with bones will be very harmful to the buddhist cause. so lets hope there are no bones.

with concern, White Lotus.
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Re: Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

Postby narraboth » Tue Aug 10, 2010 3:49 pm

I was at the tour in Newport, Wales on sunday.
Not too crowded there (Newport is a small town, even Wales is not big already), some people staying there quietly, I also did, staying in front of relics, praying and chanting many mantras... very blessful.

It's so nice to chant heart sutra in front of Arhat Sharipura's relic. Also great masters: Tsongkapa, Atisha, Longchenpa, Dudjom Rinpoche, Khyentse Chokgyi Lodro....

I am lucky enough to live in Bristol, because the next tour will be in Bath spa, England (the tour will only go to 4 or 5 places in the UK, strangely they have Newport and Bath which are so close to each other). Bristol is just between Newport and Bath, both just less than 30 mins train. So I can easily go visit those relics again next week.
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Re: Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

Postby Aemilius » Tue Aug 10, 2010 4:03 pm

How about the Diamond sutra perspective? " Those who seek me in form and sound see me not", Tathagatas are seen in seeing the Dharmakaya, the Truthbody! What then is the seeing of some little fragments of bones ? Maybe it helps you to realize that they once were real living persons ??
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Re: Relic tour in US, EU/UK and AU

Postby narraboth » Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:57 pm

Aemilius wrote:How about the Diamond sutra perspective? " Those who seek me in form and sound see me not", Tathagatas are seen in seeing the Dharmakaya, the Truthbody! What then is the seeing of some little fragments of bones ? Maybe it helps you to realize that they once were real living persons ??


The lines say the truth for sure. As buddha said, to read, think, understand and realise prajapramitra can accumulate much more merit than bowing to buddha's stupas.
However, Buddha himself also said in ratnasiddhi dharani tantra: 'buddha's relic is more precious than wish-fulfilling jewel, those who hold it will not be stained by downfall, like one who holds magic horn will keep the water away for 6 feet.' Also in Nagaraja sutra: 'those who see even the remainders of buddhist master's body, will not go to three lower realms.' There are many many more buddha's words about the benefits of paying respect to relics in both mahayana and hinayana texts. When you said 'what then is the seeing of some little fragments of bones', it seems that you either didn't read them, or you doesn't take it seriously.

Many great Tibetan lamas traveled long distance, just to bow to the famous Shakyamuni statue in Lhasa. Why they do so? Seems that they don't understand the Vajra-cutting sutra?

We need to be aware of an occasion: people tend to think 'oh, I understand this, I have high view, I don't need to pay respect to Buddha's body speech and mind representives because they are just materials.' But actually they can't even take care of their own mental weaknesses or outside negative circumstances. When they got problem, they cry and pray to dieties, dharma protectors as FORMS, they ask this and that masters for MO and blessing, seek some puja or mantras so badly that they totally forget the dharmakaya they kept on mouth is beyond good or bad. When they die, they can't be even as confident as an old word-blind lady who have accumulated many 'material' merits.

Actually in highest view, you don't need to chant mantra. Mantra is 'sound' isn't it. Visualisation is 'form' isn't it. You don't even need a flesh and blood master to guide you. However beings can't see dharmakaya directly. Even most of Buddhists can't. They always say 'emptiness, dharmakaya, nature of mind', but they just get the idea from books, like a tropical resident talking about north pole from travel books.

Remember what sutra says: 'boddhisattvas never get tired of accumulating merits' 'there is no too small merit for boddhisattva to accumulate.' Because merits and realisation are together, you can't really realise emptiness without merits. Also remember what heart sutra says: form is shunyata, SHUNYATA IS FORM. emptiness is not to deny buddha's great wisdom, compassion and ability. The blessing is really powerful, while it's shunyata AT THE SAME TIME.

I think if you have very strong faith and devotion, you will get equal blessing at your own home when praying. but don't forget, as buddha's mantra doesn't only work for people have faith: mantra can bless people or animals who have no idea on Buddhism, so does relics. The great compassion and abilities of buddha and great masters are beyond imagination.

Finally, thank you for reminding me to keep the shunyata view when I go to the next relic tour. I hope many people here will also have the luck to see those relics, keep buddha's teaching in mind at the same time.
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