What is the difference between an Arhat and Bodhisattva?

[Red Faced Buddha]

I've never fully understood the differences between Arhats and Bodhisattva.Are Arhats higher than Bodhisattva,are they the same,or are they different?Is one superior to another or are both equal?

[Virgo]

Bodhisattvas are superior.

Kevin

[Tara]

Please note: Topic moved from "Dharma-free-for-all" to "Exploring Buddhism"

[Red Faced Buddha]

Bodhisattvas are superior.

Kevin

Could you explain more than just that?Why are they superior?

[Virgo]

Bodhisattvas are superior.

Kevin

Could you explain more than just that?Why are they superior?

Because they possess the most precious jewel known in the three times: bodhicitta.

Kevin

[Astus]

First of all, there is a variety of interpretations about how arhats differ from bodhisattvas. Generally we can say that arhats are permanently free from samsara, while bodhisattvas have chosen to remain within samsara in order to help beings and accumulate merit to become buddhas. Because bodhisattvas eventually can become buddhas, it is said that because of their wish to become buddhas, they are superior to arhats in the sense that they have greater aspiration based on greater compassion, and that compassion and aspiration is what bodhicitta is.

[Terma]

I've never fully understood the differences between Arhats and Bodhisattva.Are Arhats higher than Bodhisattva,are they the same,or are they different?Is one superior to another or are both equal?

In the first chapter of Chandrakirt's text Madhyamakavatara, this is discussed I believe. I think among other things, Bodhisattva's are considered higher due to their vast accumulations of both merit and wisdom. Perhaps on a more subtle level (and one that would be a discussion on its own) would be the Bodhisattva's understanding of emptiness, but then we would have to determine which bhumi Bodhisattva we are talking about. Chandrakirti goes into detail about this as well in the verse where he is giving praise to the arhats (sravaka's).

For what it's worth, I found Dzongsar Jamyang Khyentse Rinpoche's commentary to this text quite helpful.

Terma

[deepbluehum]

Arhats and Bodhisattvas are beyond samsara, but an Arhat is said to seek their own liberation resulting in an abiding nirvana, whereas Bodhisattvas seek to liberate all beings, resulting in a non-abiding nirvana. If we follow Astus' account, a Bodhisattva is not endowed with wisdom, and they would be inferior to Arhats.

[tomamundsen]

Arhats and Bodhisattvas are beyond samsara, but an Arhat is said to seek their own liberation resulting in an abiding nirvana, whereas Bodhisattvas seek to liberate all beings, resulting in a non-abiding nirvana. If we follow Astus' account, a Bodhisattva is not endowed with wisdom, and they would be inferior to Arhats.

Yes, this is what I have been taught.

I'm probably going too far off-topic for this particular forum, but I remember Malcolm saying that Dzogchen results in an abiding nirvana at the 16th bhumi, unlike all other Mahayana systems. Do you know anything about that, DBH, or anyone else?

[deepbluehum]

Arhats and Bodhisattvas are beyond samsara, but an Arhat is said to seek their own liberation resulting in an abiding nirvana, whereas Bodhisattvas seek to liberate all beings, resulting in a non-abiding nirvana. If we follow Astus' account, a Bodhisattva is not endowed with wisdom, and they would be inferior to Arhats.

Yes, this is what I have been taught.

I'm probably going too far off-topic for this particular forum, but I remember Malcolm saying that Dzogchen results in an abiding nirvana at the 16th bhumi, unlike all other Mahayana systems. Do you know anything about that, DBH, or anyone else?

It's true. Dzogchen results in abiding nirvana. But it is said to differ from the Arhat's level, because Arhat's haven't realized lhundrub and so cannot recognize kadak-chenpo, the od kyi lus and ja lus phowa chenpo, i.e, the rainbow body of great transference.

[tomamundsen]

Arhats and Bodhisattvas are beyond samsara, but an Arhat is said to seek their own liberation resulting in an abiding nirvana, whereas Bodhisattvas seek to liberate all beings, resulting in a non-abiding nirvana. If we follow Astus' account, a Bodhisattva is not endowed with wisdom, and they would be inferior to Arhats.

Yes, this is what I have been taught.

I'm probably going too far off-topic for this particular forum, but I remember Malcolm saying that Dzogchen results in an abiding nirvana at the 16th bhumi, unlike all other Mahayana systems. Do you know anything about that, DBH, or anyone else?

It's true. Dzogchen results in abiding nirvana. But it is said to differ from the Arhat's level, because Arhat's haven't realized lhundrub and so cannot recognize kadak-chenpo, the od kyi lus and ja lus phowa chenpo, i.e, the rainbow body of great transference.

Cool. Any more info? For example, why is an abiding nirvana desirable in this context? Also, what does abiding nirvana exactly mean? I assume it means that those who attain yeshe lama (16th bhumi) can manifest appearances in Samsara to help sentient beings whereas those in non-abiding nirvana cannot. Is it something like that?

[deepbluehum]

Yes, this is what I have been taught.

I'm probably going too far off-topic for this particular forum, but I remember Malcolm saying that Dzogchen results in an abiding nirvana at the 16th bhumi, unlike all other Mahayana systems. Do you know anything about that, DBH, or anyone else?

It's true. Dzogchen results in abiding nirvana. But it is said to differ from the Arhat's level, because Arhat's haven't realized lhundrub and so cannot recognize kadak-chenpo, the od kyi lus and ja lus phowa chenpo, i.e, the rainbow body of great transference.

Cool. Any more info? For example, why is an abiding nirvana desirable in this context? Also, what does abiding nirvana exactly mean? I assume it means that those who attain yeshe lama (16th bhumi) can manifest appearances in Samsara to help sentient beings whereas those in non-abiding nirvana cannot. Is it something like that?

Yes, almost. 16th Bhumi is also non-abiding. The difference is the realization of Clear Light's extent of qualities viz kadag and lhundrub, self-perfected qualifications. Arhat's are limited, whereas 16th Bhumi are beyond all limitations, i.e., Rainbow Body of Great Transference.

[tomamundsen]

16th Bhumi is also non-abiding.

Wait, I thought we already established that it was abiding here:

It's true. Dzogchen results in abiding nirvana

Or is this result you're talking about here not the 16th bhumi?

[Ransom]

Perhaps I have been given different information than most of you, but I was taught that an Arhat (which is the Sanskrit spelling of the Pali "Arahant") is a person who has attained Nirvana through the teachings of the Buddha. Basically the same thing as a Buddha. The difference being that Gautama attained Nirvana on his own and this is why he is referred to as the Buddha, The One Who is Awake, while all others are Arhats/Arahants (AKA: saints).

A Bodhisattva, "Awakening Being", is someone who is close to becoming a Buddha, or is on the path to attaining Nirvana.

I hope that helps!! ^_^

[tomamundsen]

Perhaps I have been given different information than most of you, but I was taught that an Arhat (which is the Sanskrit spelling of the Pali "Arahant") is a person who has attained Nirvana through the teachings of the Buddha. Basically the same thing as a Buddha. The difference being that Gautama attained Nirvana on his own and this is why he is referred to as the Buddha, The One Who is Awake, while all others are Arhats/Arahants (AKA: saints).

A Bodhisattva, "Awakening Being", is someone who is close to becoming a Buddha, or is on the path to attaining Nirvana.

I hope that helps!! ^_^

Yes, that is the view from the Theravada side of things. In Mahayana, things are viewed differently. And since DharmaWheel is dedicated to Mahayana, people around here are pretty quick to accept Mahayana teachings over Theravada.

[Ransom]

Perhaps I have been given different information than most of you, but I was taught that an Arhat (which is the Sanskrit spelling of the Pali "Arahant") is a person who has attained Nirvana through the teachings of the Buddha. Basically the same thing as a Buddha. The difference being that Gautama attained Nirvana on his own and this is why he is referred to as the Buddha, The One Who is Awake, while all others are Arhats/Arahants (AKA: saints).

A Bodhisattva, "Awakening Being", is someone who is close to becoming a Buddha, or is on the path to attaining Nirvana.

I hope that helps!! ^_^

Yes, that is the view from the Theravada side of things. In Mahayana, things are viewed differently. And since DharmaWheel is dedicated to Mahayana, people around here are pretty quick to accept Mahayana teachings over Theravada.

I'm not going based on any tradition. Rather the definitions of the words themselves. =)

[tomamundsen]

Perhaps I have been given different information than most of you, but I was taught that an Arhat (which is the Sanskrit spelling of the Pali "Arahant") is a person who has attained Nirvana through the teachings of the Buddha. Basically the same thing as a Buddha. The difference being that Gautama attained Nirvana on his own and this is why he is referred to as the Buddha, The One Who is Awake, while all others are Arhats/Arahants (AKA: saints).

A Bodhisattva, "Awakening Being", is someone who is close to becoming a Buddha, or is on the path to attaining Nirvana.

I hope that helps!! ^_^

Yes, that is the view from the Theravada side of things. In Mahayana, things are viewed differently. And since DharmaWheel is dedicated to Mahayana, people around here are pretty quick to accept Mahayana teachings over Theravada.

I'm not going based on any tradition. Rather the definitions of the words themselves. =)

Yes, well the thing is that the semantics of the words are different according to the different traditions.

In Theravada, an arahant and a Buddha are only different in that the Buddha attained nibbana first. In Mahayana, a Buddha has also removed all cognitive obscurations and is omniscient. Arahants/Arhats only remove emotional obscurations. Furthermore, bodhisattas are simply those who will eventually become buddhas. But in Mahayana, there is emphasis that bodhisattvas possess bodhicitta. For this reason, people typically use "arahant" to refer to the term from the Nikaya perspective and "arhat" from the Mahayana perspective; similarly bodhisatta and bodhisattva. However, Buddha is quite a confusing term as pretty much all traditions have slightly different views even though they use the same word.

[Rakshasa]

It is common for Buddhists to often talk about Arhats in a disparaging tone while comparing them with the Bodhisattvas, almost like the Arhats are not only lower compared to the Bodhisattvas, they are in fact lower to average Buddhist lay disciples (humans) also. This is not a good thinking in all schools of Buddhism.

Arhats are superior to all the Devas, including the Brahmas, so they do deserve their own respect and veneration. In comparison to Bodhisattvas, Arhats are superior to even Bodhisattvas of the 8th Bhumi (will need to confirm this though).

In the end, Arhats attain Nirvana.

[Astus]

Just to add to this plethora of interpretations and ideas, in East Asian Buddhism - based primarily on the Lotus Sutra - arhats attain only a seeming nirvana and once they're awaken from it by the buddhas they continue their path to liberation as high level (8th bhumi) bodhisattvas. So, according to this view, there is only one kind of nirvana, that of the buddha.

[muni]

It is common for Buddhists to often talk about Arhats in a disparaging tone while comparing them with the Bodhisattvas,.

I think so, when there is insight, seeing clear, there is no need to compare, and so quarrels about never arise.

We can only rejoice for fellows good practice.