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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:39 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:14 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:40 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Sherlock wrote:
You changed the title of this thread when I was typing my reply. You were asking if it were possible to complete the whole path through dream yoga alone.


:jawdrop:

I'm actually still asking the same exact thing.

I guess I have to stop using Dzogchen language on this forum.


You were asking about going the whole way completely through dream yoga. Be precise.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:40 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:42 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
You can eliminate delusions about the nature of the base and oneself, which is based on mental concepts.


No the delusion is based on not recognizing the display of the five lights.

It has nothing to do with mental concepts.

Delusion is a mental phenomena.
It may be "based" on failure to recognize the five lights etc. but one doesnt just manifest rainbow body by eliminating the mental phenomena of delusion.
If so, there would be no point in statements 2 and 3 of Garab Dorje.

There is an important distinction between delusion regarding ones nature and fully manifesting ones nature.


Last edited by Josef on Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:43 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:45 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:46 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
Delusion is a mental phenomena.
It may be "based" on failure to recognize the five lights etc. but one doesnt just manifest rainbow body by eliminating the mental phenomena of delusion.
If so, there would be no point in statements 2 and 3 of Garab Dorje.



Dude you are the only one talking about mental phenomena.

Nope.
You keep asking about delusion so I am answering based upon the language used in the question.
You might want to find different language to get your point more clearly stated.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:47 am 
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Delusion is a false belief or opinion.
Beliefs and opinions are based upon mind and mental concepts.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:47 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:07 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:48 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Sherlock wrote:

You were asking about going the whole way completely through dream yoga. Be precise.



Yes and I am saying eliminating ALL delusion regarding the BASIS

:crazy:


I am saying the same freaking thing.


It is impossible for anyone to practice ONLY dream yoga unless you are sleeping 24/7. Your question was imprecise, that is all that I am saying, please stop the condescending attitude.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:52 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
You keep asking about delusion so I am answering based upon the language used in the question.
You might want to find different language to get your point more clearly stated.


I'm using the same language as Malcolm here:

viewtopic.php?f=48&t=7522&p=89967&hilit=delusion#p89967

Get educated my fellow Dzogchenpa brother.


That's fine but I don't see Malcolm equating removal of delusion with rainbow body in that post.
His post and the references it contains is describing the way in which beings and phenomena manifest as samsara etc.

Questioning my education is both rude and laughable.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:56 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
You can eliminate delusions about the nature of the base and oneself, which is based on mental concepts.


whatever. I know what I am talking about.


I am starting to seriously doubt that.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:57 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:58 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
That's fine but I don't see Malcolm equating removal of delusion with rainbow body in that post.


"Sentient beings are deluded about the display of the basis. When they cease to be so deluded, they are buddhas. "

But feel free to believe whatever you want to believe.


I dont see anything about rainbow body in that post.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:00 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:02 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:


If you don't understand what the five lights are, mentioned several times in that post, I can't help you bro.


More assumptions.
Its always odd when people make statements about the understanding of others rather than actually examining their own.


Last edited by Josef on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:02 am 
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waste of my time


Last edited by SSJ3Gogeta on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:03 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
SSJ3Gogeta wrote:


If you don't understand what the five lights are, mentioned several times in that post, I can't help you bro.


More assumptions.



its obvious.


You can say that but it is clear that there are subtleties that are being ignored.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:04 am 
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SSJ3Gogeta,

You are incredibly arrogant, and really quite immature.

You ought to calm down and reflect upon your own behaviour, as it's really not something to brag about.

You have post after post on this forum, where you write nonsensical things, that really shows that you have no idea.

Just one such example, is the silly statement "Naropa is overrated"...

Please grow up.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:06 am 
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Josef wrote:
You can say that but it is clear that there are subtleties that are being ignored.


This is just a pointless conversation. You don't understand the basis (gzhi) of Dzogchen upadesha. Its as simple as that.


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