Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Can one eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?
Sherlock
Posts: 1202
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 3:14 pm

Re: Can one finish whole path with dream yoga?

Post by Sherlock »

This is completely hypothetical except in the case of coma patients. To even get into dreams of clarity regularly you need some practice in your waking life.
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Sherlock wrote:This is completely hypothetical except in the case of coma patients.
ChNN is not in a coma, and practices dream yoga all the time.

I'm just not sure if dream yoga can be used to eliminate all delusion regarding the basis.
User avatar
Wesley1982
Posts: 739
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:45 pm
Location: Magga ~ Path to Liberation.

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Wesley1982 »

I would presume that delusion has do to with the psychosomatic function in the brain.
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Wesley1982 wrote:I would presume that delusion has do with the psychosomatic function in the brain.

No it comes from neutral awareness (sh shes pa lung ma bstan) not recognizing itself.
User avatar
Wesley1982
Posts: 739
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:45 pm
Location: Magga ~ Path to Liberation.

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Wesley1982 »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:No it comes from neutral awareness (sh shes pa lung ma bstan) not recognizing itself.
Oh, then I must be referring to something else. Cognition or Cognitive function?..not sure but "delusion" does and can happen.
User avatar
DarwidHalim
Posts: 418
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:04 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by DarwidHalim »

Definitely can.

However, there is always a question of what do you mean by the elimination of all delusions?

Do you mean that when someone hits you, your anger will no longer appear?
I am not here nor there.
I am not right nor wrong.
I do not exist neither non-exist.
I am not I nor non-I.
I am not in samsara nor nirvana.
To All Buddhas, I bow down for the teaching of emptiness. Thank You!
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Whats so hard to understand about the basis (gzhi)?

If you guys don't understand dzogchen upadesha.......
User avatar
Josef
Posts: 2611
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Josef »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:Can one eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?
Probably, but it would only work if one has already has stable recognition during the waking state.
It is simply impractical to practice Dream Yoga exclusively without already establishing significant experience while awake.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
CrawfordHollow
Posts: 265
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 10:56 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by CrawfordHollow »

I think the opportunity always exits for liberation, regardless if we are in the dream state, waking state or in the bardo. Isn't this what makes Dzogchen so direct? But, no I don't really understand Dzogchen, so...
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Josef wrote:
SSJ3Gogeta wrote:Can one eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?
Probably, but it would only work if one has already has stable recognition during the waking state.
It is simply impractical to practice Dream Yoga exclusively without already establishing significant experience while awake.

For discussion's sake, lets assume integrated trekcho while awake.
Sherlock
Posts: 1202
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 3:14 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Sherlock »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Sherlock wrote:This is completely hypothetical except in the case of coma patients.
ChNN is not in a coma, and practices dream yoga all the time.

I'm just not sure if dream yoga can be used to eliminate all delusion regarding the basis.
You changed the title of this thread when I was typing my reply. You were asking if it were possible to complete the whole path through dream yoga alone.
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Sherlock wrote:You changed the title of this thread when I was typing my reply. You were asking if it were possible to complete the whole path through dream yoga alone.
:jawdrop:

I'm actually still asking the same exact thing.

I guess I have to stop using Dzogchen language on this forum.
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Ok to dumb things down for the masses:

Can dream yoga lead to rainbow body?
User avatar
Josef
Posts: 2611
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Josef »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote:
SSJ3Gogeta wrote:Can one eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?
Probably, but it would only work if one has already has stable recognition during the waking state.
It is simply impractical to practice Dream Yoga exclusively without already establishing significant experience while awake.

For discussion's sake, lets assume integrated trekcho while awake.
It would be redundant but sure.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
User avatar
Josef
Posts: 2611
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Josef »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:Ok to dumb things down for the masses:

Can dream yoga lead to rainbow body?
That doesnt really "dumb things down", it actually complicates the question.

Since one can implement the methods that lead to rainbow body during dream yoga I dont see why it would be impossible.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Josef wrote: That doesnt really "dumb things down", it actually complicates the question.
Well actually its the same freaking question.

Eliminating all delusion regarding the basis = "rainbow body".


:rolling:
User avatar
Josef
Posts: 2611
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Josef »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote: That doesnt really "dumb things down", it actually complicates the question.
Well actually its the same exact question.

Eliminating all delusion regarding the basis = "rainbow body".
I wouldnt say that.
One can eliminate delusions and one can fully integrate.
One is dependent upon the mind while the other is not.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
SSJ3Gogeta
Posts: 189
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by SSJ3Gogeta »

Josef wrote: I wouldnt say that.
One can eliminate delusions and one can fully integrate.
One is dependent upon the mind while the other is not.
What?
User avatar
Josef
Posts: 2611
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm

Re: Eliminate all delusion regarding the basis with dream yoga?

Post by Josef »

SSJ3Gogeta wrote:
Josef wrote: I wouldnt say that.
One can eliminate delusions and one can fully integrate.
One is dependent upon the mind while the other is not.
What?
Delusion is a based on mind.
True realization like rainbow body is not.
You can eliminate delusions about the nature of the base and oneself, which is based on mental concepts.
You can fully integrate into that nature, which is not based on mental concepts.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
Locked

Return to “Dzogchen”