Amitabha dies?

Re: Amitabha dies?

Postby sinweiy » Sat May 19, 2012 11:26 am

Nighthawk wrote:
Sinweiy, thanks for explaining further but I've read elsewhere that this is not the case so I'm a bit confused here. :thinking:


what did they said?

can read this:-
http://www.kagyu.org/kagyulineage/buddh ... /cul02.php

The seventh and last quality is called the limb of perennial manifestation, which means that the Sambhogakaya cannot cease to be, but has manifested throughout the ages. There is no such thing as Sambhogakaya ceasing to exist in the way that the Nirmanakaya is withdrawn when the Buddha enters paranirvana.

Nirmanakaya and Sambhogakaya manifest in a compassionate way through four major modes. The first mode is called the "ever present manifestation of compassion," which means that compassion is inherent in the realization of the Sambhogakaya. This compassion has always been here, and because it is ever present, it is inexhaustible at the Sambhogakaya level. So even if the buddha passes into paranirvana--even if the Nirmanakaya stops manifesting for a while--the manifestation of compassion does not cease on the Sambhogakaya level.
_/\_
Amituofo!

"Enlightenment is to turn around and see MY own mistake, Other's mistake is also my mistake. Others are right even if they are wrong. i'm wrong even if i'm right. " - Master Chin Kung
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Re: Amitabha dies?

Postby Nighthawk » Sat May 19, 2012 11:34 am

sinweiy wrote:
Nighthawk wrote:
Sinweiy, thanks for explaining further but I've read elsewhere that this is not the case so I'm a bit confused here. :thinking:


what did they said?

can read this:-
http://www.kagyu.org/kagyulineage/buddh ... /cul02.php

The seventh and last quality is called the limb of perennial manifestation, which means that the Sambhogakaya cannot cease to be, but has manifested throughout the ages. There is no such thing as Sambhogakaya ceasing to exist in the way that the Nirmanakaya is withdrawn when the Buddha enters paranirvana.

Nirmanakaya and Sambhogakaya manifest in a compassionate way through four major modes. The first mode is called the "ever present manifestation of compassion," which means that compassion is inherent in the realization of the Sambhogakaya. This compassion has always been here, and because it is ever present, it is inexhaustible at the Sambhogakaya level. So even if the buddha passes into paranirvana--even if the Nirmanakaya stops manifesting for a while--the manifestation of compassion does not cease on the Sambhogakaya level.


Thanks for this finding, I will read into it deeper.
I was referring to the book by a book by Paul Williams called Mahayana: Doctrinal Foundations in which he says the Sambhogakaya form is impermanent except for in Tibetan Buddhism.
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Re: Amitabha dies?

Postby sinweiy » Sat May 19, 2012 11:39 am

quote:

The idea of three bodies should not mislead us into thinking that there are three different entities. Dharmakaya and Sambhogakaya do not refer to entities so much as existential states of being, and only the Nirmanakaya body is created anew in physical form. Actually the three kayas are two bodies--the formless body and the body of form. Both the Sambhogakaya and Nirmanakaya are normally called the 'form" bodies of the Buddha, while Dharmakaya is formless.


When we call the Sambhogakaya a "form body," we do not mean physical form but instead form in the sense of manifesting and being determinate, as opposed to Dharmakaya, which is formless because it is not determinate. The Sambhogakaya is determinate because, although it is not physical, it does manifest in varieties of ways. If Sambhogakaya is fully realized, then one can receive different teachings and meanings from many natural sources, such as sound, sight, and so on.


Sambhogakaya is some what in between Dharmakaya and Nirmanakaya.
_/\_
Amituofo!

"Enlightenment is to turn around and see MY own mistake, Other's mistake is also my mistake. Others are right even if they are wrong. i'm wrong even if i'm right. " - Master Chin Kung
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Re: Amitabha dies?

Postby sinweiy » Sat May 19, 2012 1:11 pm

Nighthawk wrote:
Thanks for this finding, I will read into it deeper.
I was referring to the book by a book by Paul Williams called Mahayana: Doctrinal Foundations in which he says the Sambhogakaya form is impermanent except for in Tibetan Buddhism.


we would not want to pinned it down as "except for in Tibetan Buddhism".

since it stated that Dharmakaya corresponds with one's mind, Sambhogakaya with one's speech, and Nirmanakaya with one's body. and speech accompany the body, hence we can say it's impermanent with the mouth/body, but does not mean it'll "cease" in the next manifestation, as it has been realised.
even the mind is impermanent in a sense that dependent arising thoughts are impermanent.
_/\_
Amituofo!

"Enlightenment is to turn around and see MY own mistake, Other's mistake is also my mistake. Others are right even if they are wrong. i'm wrong even if i'm right. " - Master Chin Kung
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Re: Amitabha dies?

Postby Son » Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:37 pm

Nighthawk wrote:Seems like a big contradiction from what I've always been taught. I've always been taught that Buddhas never abandon beings and they go on working tirelessly for all eternity since there are infinite beings and that Buddhas achieve a state called apratisthita nirvana aka nonabiding/unrestricted Nirvana.


... It's best not to get carried away. Living beings who achieve Supreme Awakening to teach Dharma to the world are sammasambuddhas, and they achieve the deathless, the absolute bliss, the eternal consciousness of nibbana (snuffing out). Bodhisattvas, Enlightenment Beings, Yidams, Pure Lands, and mystical instructions are important and beneficial, but try not to disregard the teachings of Lord Siddhartha Gautama our Buddha, favoring a specific view of a later teaching and leading you to opinions that go against what the Buddha taught.

Experience, reason, intelligence. These are more important and more vital than blindly following the teachings of a specific tradition, even if it is called "Buddhist" tradition. Remember what the Buddha said about following traditions, elders, common belief, pure logic, etc.

:reading:
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