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Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture? - Dhamma Wheel

Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Meditation, e.g. meditation postures, developing a regular sitting practice, skillfully relating to difficulties and hindrances, etc.
starter
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Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby starter » Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:39 am

Hi friends,

“And what is the food for the arising of unarisen rapture as a factor for
awakening, or for the growth & increase of rapture as a factor for
awakening once it has arisen? There are qualities that act as a foothold for
rapture as a factor for awakening. To foster appropriate attention to
them: This is the food for the arising of unarisen rapture as a factor for
awakening, or for the growth & increase of rapture as a factor for
awakening once it has arisen.” —SN 46:51

What are the mental qualities that act as a foothold/food for rapture as a factor for Awakening?

Dana/caga, sila, Mindfulness, samadhi, investigation of dhammas, mental delight/joy?

Metta,

Starter
Last edited by starter on Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Individual
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby Individual » Sun Dec 26, 2010 1:13 pm

Any negative mental qualities bring misery and any positive mental qualities bring joy.

A good place to start might be reflecting on thoughts of relaxation, universal goodwill, warm light, and the freedom of the mindfulness of the present.
The best things in life aren't things.


Reductor
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby Reductor » Sun Dec 26, 2010 8:45 pm

Seclusion, tranquility and concentration.

There are many things that can be used for the development of rapture, but in meditation those listed above are good to pay attention to, starting with bodily and mental seclusion.

Outside of mediation you are advised to reflect on generosity, virtue, dhamma, buddha, sangha and the rest. But any wholesome thing can be reflected upon to establish spiritual rapture/joy.

After you've been practising for a while you can reflect on the wholesome changes that have taken place in you life and in your mind. Any increased perception of peace due to your practice is fair game.

Kenshou
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby Kenshou » Mon Dec 27, 2010 3:37 am


Reductor
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby Reductor » Mon Dec 27, 2010 7:18 am

Thanks for those references, Kenshou. Good stuff.

starter
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Re: Factors contributing to piti and sukha?

Postby starter » Mon Feb 21, 2011 4:43 pm

Hello Teachers/Friends,

Many thanks for all the nice comments and helpful input. Since the arising of piti and sukha are crucial for entering jhana, I'd like to continue this thread.

It's strange that I experienced piti and sukha before, but not recently. I don't think it's because my mental qualities (e.g. mindfulness, investigation of dhammas, physical and mental seclusion, ...) are worsened than half a year ago. I'm now wondering if too shallow breath or still breath is the cause. I tried to breathe harder, but still no piti, let alone sukha (sukha seems to occur after the sufficient accumulation of piti).

Hope to get your advice. Metta,

Starter

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IanAnd
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Re: Factors contributing to piti and sukha?

Postby IanAnd » Mon Feb 21, 2011 6:00 pm

"The gift of truth exceeds all other gifts" — Dhammapada, v. 354 Craving XXIV

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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby starter » Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:38 pm

Hello IanAnd,

Many thanks for your very helpful comments and advice.

"It sounds as though you are "trying" too hard. Just relax and let things arise of their own accord."

-- I agree with you completely. It's probably the desire for jhana itself which is the hindrance to enter jhana. When I didn't know what's jhana/piti/sukha and didn't seek after them, piti and sukha occurred naturally. But when I meditate with the desire to obtain them, they seem to disappear ...

Metta,

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daverupa
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby daverupa » Wed Mar 23, 2011 9:37 pm

As part of my continuing series on anapanasati, I have been perusing this thread. I can see the usefulness of the "just keep sitting" advice because of the tendency to get excited when piti and sukha arise, as they are jhana factors and us layfolk tend to get all excited about jhana, which unsettles sati.

In any event, rapture and pleasure are components of the second tetrad of anapanasati, and that's all I'm after - the Samyutta Nikaya mentions that a trainee is one who has partly developed the four establishments of mindfulness, and since anapanasati fulfills these four, that's my sole interest. Jhana will happen, or not, but I'm unconcerned about it.

It seems that in my case, I've been meditating long enough for the pursuit and grasping after piti and sukha to not arise as a problem, simply because i'm used their arising. When I first began meditating, it was a lot of kundalini and related Taoist approaches via Glenn Morris and a method called the Secret Smile, wherein a series of positive emotions were willed into existence and used for various meditatively energetic tasks. In any event, the arising of piti and sukha occurs apart from the willed component of that practice; I've seen the terrain many times, it's just that I should have turned left at Albuquerque...

Now, in making that left, I'm much more confident that I've gotten pointed in the right direction, and will likely continue in my practice for some time before having further experiences to convey, and further questions to ask. Thanks to all for their input thus far; I look forward to harvesting your minds in the future!

:anjali:
:heart:

rowyourboat
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby rowyourboat » Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:38 pm

Tipitaka Anguttara Nikaya Elevens
AN 11.1 PTS: A v 311
Kimattha Sutta: What is the Purpose?
translated from the Pali by
Thanissaro Bhikkhu
© 1997–2011
I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying near Savatthi in Jeta's Grove, Anathapindika's monastery. Then Ven. Ananda went to the Blessed One and on arrival, having bowed down to him, sat to one side. As he was sitting there he said to the Blessed One: "What is the purpose of skillful virtues? What is their reward?"

"Skillful virtues have freedom from remorse as their purpose, Ananda, and freedom from remorse as their reward."

"And what is the purpose of freedom from remorse? What is its reward?"

"Freedom from remorse has joy as its purpose, joy as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of joy? What is its reward?"

"Joy has rapture as its purpose, rapture as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of rapture? What is its reward?"

"Rapture has serenity as its purpose, serenity as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of serenity? What is its reward?"

"Serenity has pleasure as its purpose, pleasure as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of pleasure? What is its reward?"

"Pleasure has concentration as its purpose, concentration as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of concentration? What is its reward?"

"Concentration has knowledge & vision of things as they actually are as its purpose, knowledge & vision of things as they actually are as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of knowledge & vision of things as they actually are? What is its reward?"

"Knowledge & vision of things as they actually are has disenchantment as its purpose, disenchantment as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of disenchantment? What is its reward?"

"Disenchantment has dispassion as its purpose, dispassion as its reward."

"And what is the purpose of dispassion? What is its reward?"

"Dispassion has knowledge & vision of release as its purpose, knowledge & vision of release as its reward.

"Thus in this way, Ananda, skillful virtues have freedom from remorse as their purpose, freedom from remorse as their reward. Freedom from remorse has joy as its purpose, joy as its reward. Joy has rapture as its purpose, rapture as its reward. Rapture has serenity as its purpose, serenity as its reward. Serenity has pleasure as its purpose, pleasure as its reward. Pleasure has concentration as its purpose, concentration as its reward. Concentration has knowledge & vision of things as they actually are as its purpose, knowledge & vision of things as they actually are as its reward. Knowledge & vision of things as they actually are has disenchantment as its purpose, disenchantment as its reward. Disenchantment has dispassion as its purpose, dispassion as its reward. Dispassion has knowledge & vision of release as its purpose, knowledge & vision of release as its reward.

"In this way, Ananda, skillful virtues lead step-by-step to the consummation of arahantship."
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html.
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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daverupa
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Re: Mental qualities acting as a foothold for rapture?

Postby daverupa » Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:55 pm



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