Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

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Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Aemilius » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:01 pm

The original Lalitavistara sutra was taken out of India, i. e. the version where the period of His love life is included. It circulated widely, it had a vast influence, this influence can be seen in such literary works as Boccacio's Decamerone and Chaucer's Cantenbury Tales. They both have a stamp of Shakyamuni's life story, the feeling of the real existence of Bhagavan Shakyamuni.
According to Etienne Lamotte Gopa is mentioned as Shakyamuni's wife in several other Mahayana sutras besides Lalitavistara, in the Shurangamasamadhi sutra she has a chapter, and she features also in the Suvarnabhasha sutra. In the footnotes of the Shurangamasamadhi Lamotte says:
" According to the Mahayana Upadesha of Nagarjuna bodhisattva Siddhartha had two wives; first was called Gopa or Gopiya, second was called Yashodhara, first one did not give children."
"Mulasarvastivadin Vinaya attributes three wives to Him, each surrounded by 20 000 courtesans: Yashodhara, Gopa, and Mrigaja"
"Seven days before the Great Departure when the future Buddha was returning to His palace Mrigaja addressed Him with the famous stanza: Nibbuta nuna sa mala; Shakyamuni in thanks cast a necklace to the young woman,"
(T 1450, ch3. p. 114b, Rockhill op. cit. pp 23-24)
Buston's Blue Annals mentions that bodhisattva Gautama had two wives and gives their tibetan names.
In a Driking Kagyu life story of Siddhartha you find:"In addition He accepted other Queens and their retinues, totalling 84 000 in all."
( The Great Kagyu Masters the Golden Lineage Treasury, Snow Lion 1990)
Modern ethnic buddhists tend to be lutheran-protestant in style and attitude, they automatically make Siddhartha Gautama a monogamous person, therefore you must value this statement, that Drikung Kagyu has told us, as something very precious.
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Astus » Wed Jul 14, 2010 2:49 pm

I don't think this monogamous Buddha concept is because of Christian background as we get that story from Theravada. Also, what do you mean by "ethnic buddhists" in this context?
"There is no such thing as the real mind. Ridding yourself of delusion: that's the real mind."
(Sheng-yen: Getting the Buddha Mind, p 73)

"Neither cultivation nor seated meditation — this is the pure Chan of Tathagata."
(Mazu Daoyi, X1321p3b23; tr. Jinhua Jia)

“Don’t rashly seek the true Buddha;
True Buddha can’t be found.
Does marvelous nature and spirit
Need tempering or refinement?
Mind is this mind carefree;
This face, the face at birth."

(Nanyue Mingzan: Enjoying the Way, tr. Jeff Shore; T2076p461b24-26)
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Indrajala » Thu Jul 15, 2010 1:14 am

Aemilius wrote:Modern ethnic buddhists tend to be lutheran-protestant in style and attitude, they automatically make Siddhartha Gautama a monogamous person, therefore you must value this statement, that Drikung Kagyu has told us, as something very precious.


That's one hell of a broad statement.

Hundreds of millions of people across a dozen or more cultures all tend to make Gautama a monogamous person?
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Gyalpo » Thu Jul 15, 2010 7:37 am

I think in those times it was quite normal to have several wifes and concubines. I dont see Gautama to be monogamous, but there is allways one primary wife, according to theravada it was Yashodhara.

Also, when you read about Marpa Lotsawa, you find out, that he has wife Dagmema. But in fact, he has all together -if I remember right- eight wifes.
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Aemilius » Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:51 am

Huseng wrote:
Aemilius wrote:Modern ethnic buddhists tend to be lutheran-protestant in style and attitude, they automatically make Siddhartha Gautama a monogamous person, therefore you must value this statement, that Drikung Kagyu has told us, as something very precious.


That's one hell of a broad statement.

Hundreds of millions of people across a dozen or more cultures all tend to make Gautama a monogamous person?


I'm sorry for this broad accusation. I felt a need to put something suitably negative into it. I don't wish to enumerate the nationalities of ethnic buddhists I have met, but a common thing seems to be an acceptance of somekind of lutheran values, how else could you put it ? It goes so deep that you feel ashamed of it, but I still don't feel like telling any examples, I think people born in Scandinavia, which is 90% lutheran area, have more faith in the existence of enlightened persons than do ethnic and educated buddhists, who seem to hate everyone who thinks that there have ever been enlightened persons! This has lead one to think that it is the driving force in them, the cause why they are buddhists and why they participate in buddhist gatherings, they are driven by jealousy, by a wish to destroy the european faith in Three Treasures, they want own what they don't have anymore. May be this is just a normal course of history; thesis, antithesis and synthesis kind of phenomenon?
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Astus » Fri Jul 16, 2010 10:05 am

Asian Buddhists aiming to destroy Western Buddhism? Are you serious? And all this based on how many wives Siddhartha had?
"There is no such thing as the real mind. Ridding yourself of delusion: that's the real mind."
(Sheng-yen: Getting the Buddha Mind, p 73)

"Neither cultivation nor seated meditation — this is the pure Chan of Tathagata."
(Mazu Daoyi, X1321p3b23; tr. Jinhua Jia)

“Don’t rashly seek the true Buddha;
True Buddha can’t be found.
Does marvelous nature and spirit
Need tempering or refinement?
Mind is this mind carefree;
This face, the face at birth."

(Nanyue Mingzan: Enjoying the Way, tr. Jeff Shore; T2076p461b24-26)
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Aemilius » Fri Jul 16, 2010 10:53 am

Astus wrote:Asian Buddhists aiming to destroy Western Buddhism? Are you serious? And all this based on how many wives Siddhartha had?


Don't misread me, the question has nothing to do with the wives, I would very much like to be in the wrong ofcourse,...
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Re: Wives of Siddhartha Gautama II

Postby Aemilius » Fri Jul 16, 2010 11:06 am

Astus wrote:I don't think this monogamous Buddha concept is because of Christian background as we get that story from Theravada. Also, what do you mean by "ethnic buddhists" in this context?


Leaving the question of Theravada aside, I looked at various definitions of "ethnic". Basically it is the root word for nationality and nation, from greek. Nowadays it is often used of minority nationalities within a state. For common people it has lost its original meaning, they don't see that they are also an ethnic group, they think that it means more or less "foreigners", which ofcourse is totally wrong. "Ethnic buddhist" is a similar to "ethnic lutheran" etc..., which I'm sure you will know. You don't have to live in another country to belong to an ethnic group.
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