Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

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kalden yungdrung
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Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby kalden yungdrung » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:21 pm

Tashi delek,

Bon has a link with Buddha Shakyamuni and Garab Dorje.
Buddha Shakyamuni is called in Bon Sangwa Dupa and does belong to the Uninterrupted Lineage

All the collected informations stem from the book:
” Masters
of the
Zhang Zhung Nyengyud”

by: Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche


LINEAGE TREE

Gyerpung Nangzher Lodpo is important for another reason, too. He unified in himself all the lineages of the Zhang Zhung Nyengyud. The lineage we have been discussing so far is known as the Uninterrupted Lineage,64 so called because all the Masters in this lineage followed one after the other with no chronological breaks.

However, there was also an Interrupted Lineage65 which had several branches. This lineage is known as 'interrupted' not because it was actually interrupted but because gaps appeared in the chronology of the Masters when the oral tradition was written down. This is how Pa Tengyal Zangpo, the compiler of the life-stories of the Masters explains this:
[ there does not exist a total chronology for the transmission of the above instructions. Well then, it might be objected, if there does not exist an original source for the transmission of these instructions, how then may this be distinguished as Bon? The original source of any transmission is exceedingly important! We answer that, with regard to this original source, it was transmitted from Horti Chenpo (who is a reliable source).

So, this transmission which has become divided and fragmented, still has a single root (which is the great Horti). For the reason (that it has become fragmented), it is called "the discontinuous transmission.,, 66
There were 3 branches of the Interrupted Lineage which came directly to the Drubthob-Mahasiddhas of Zhang Zhung from 3 different Dersheg-Buddhas of the Mind to Mind Lineage:

- ChimeyTsugphu,
- Yeshen Tsugphu 67
- Sangwa Dupa (Buddha Shakyamuni).
Sangwa Dupa.jpg
Sangwa Dupa.jpg (152.67 KiB) Viewed 3312 times



All 3 branches came together with the Uninterrupted Lineage in Gurub Nangzher Lodpo.



ZHANG ZHUNG AND GARAB DORJE

In the branch of the Interrupted Lineage stemming from Sangwa Dupa we find a very interesting figure, a Master known as Zhang Zhung Garab.


64 Tib. rgyud pa 'khrug med.
65 Tib. rgyud pa 'khrug can.
66 Reynolds, The Oral Tradition p. 68.
67 According to Y ongdzin Lopan Tenzin Namdak, although Yeshen Tsugphii does not appear among the line of the Nine Dershegs, he is a Buddha and has a direct lineage from Kuntu Zangpo.


Several leading scholars of Bon such as Yongdzin Lopon Tenzin Namdak, Samten G. Karmay and John M. Reynolds have suggested that this Master might be identical with Garab Dorje of the Nyingma Dzogchen lineage.68

It may be then, that both Tibetan lineages of Dzogchen have a single root not only in terms of their ultimate source, Bonku/ Dharmakaya, but also in terms of lineage. Both lineages came from Central Asia to Tibet via different countries, with the Nyingma lineage tracing its origin to Oddiyana (Tib. Urgyen)69 and the Bonpo lineage coming to Tibet from Zhang Zhung.

Oddiyana (Urgyen) and Zhang Zhung were neighboring countries and their borders were vague, not like in our modern times.

Several Bonpo Drubthob Mahasiddhas such as Drenpa Namkha, Tsewang Rigdzin, 70 Perna Thongdrol and others travelled back and forth between Zhang Zhung and Oddiyana; furthermore there is a Cycle of Indian Bon. 72

So Garab Dorje and Zhang Zhung Garab may indeed be the same person. This hypothesis is further supported by the fact that Bonpo and Nyingma Dzogchen do not differ in terms of their base, path, view, or result. All this, then, suggests a common source.

There is also later textual evidence which connects Garab Dorje with Bonpo Dzogchen. For example, in the text the Golden Spoon 73 rediscovered by the great terton 74 Yungdrung Lingpa 75 we read:

Vairotsana was sitting in the Tiger's Nest 76 in Bhutan. When he was practicing in the cave there one night, the cave became filled with light, the earth trembled and emitted sounds like a dragon roaring. Vairotsana looked in front of him and in a rainbow circle he saw Drenpa Namkha77 with his two sons 78 they appeared directly to him.


68 Oral communication from Yongdzin Lopan Tenzin Namdak; Karmay, The Little Luminous Boy, p. 7; Reynolds, The Oral Tradition, p. 59; John Myrdhin Reynolds, The Golden Letters, (Ithaca, New York: Snow Lion Publications, 1996), p. 227.
69 Tib. U rgyan.
70 Tib. Tshe dbang Rig 'dzin.
71 Tib. Pad rna mThong grol
72 Tib. rgya gar bon skor. For more information on Bon of India see Ermakov, Be and Bon,pp.23,205-206.
73 Tib. rDzogs chen gser thur ma lo rgyus spyi ching chen mo gab pa 'byed pa'i Ide mig zhes bya ba bzhugs,
74 Tib. gter ton - Spiritual Treasure Discoverer.
75 Tib.g.Yung drung gLing pa alias Tib. rDor rje gLing pa (1346-1405) was one of several tertons who found both Bonpo and Nyingma termas.
76 Tib. sPa gro stag tshang.
77 This is the second Drenpa Namkha, the prince of Zhang Zhung. See footnote 16.
78 I.e. Tsewang Rigdzin and Pema Thongdrol just mentioned above.


Drenpa Namkha was white in colour and decorated with the 6 bone ornaments. In his right hand he was holding up a Swastika which was spinning by his head. In his left hand he was holding a skull cup filled with blood. Under his arm he was holding a trident decorated with semiprecious and precious stones as well as with various silk drapes. He was in a dancing posture, and he was moving.

His son, Tsewang Rigdzin, was a darkish white colour. All his ornaments and decorations were penect and Vairotsana saw him clearly. He felt devotion to him at that time. This teaching was written in gold and kept inside a gold reliquary box. Drenpa Namkha touched Vairotsana's forehead, neck and chest with it and gave him the 4 empowerments.

He gave him the 3 important points of teaching and also advice.

He said: 'Ho! Boy of awareness, spiritual son! Do not be deluded! Listen to me!,
I am Garab Dorje,
I am Drenpa Namkha
I am Lhagod Thoglebar, 79
I am Namkha Yungdrung, 80
I am also Drugse, Chemchog Kagying.81
I show a Bon sku form.

To whoever is devoted to me, I will appear as Sambhogakaya, Impure beings will see me as Nirmanakaya. I am the King of the Quintessence of the 3 Kayas. I am also the Free Life, Lachen Drenpa, the great lama of Namkha.
This is the essence of the Ultimate Vehicle of Bon. This is the drops of nectar from the golden spoon. Practise and then hide this as a treasure.' And then he gave the teachings to Vairotsana. Vairotsana hid it in the Tiger's Nest.82
Tapihritsa is also said to have been one of the emanations of Drenpa Namkha83 so this brings us back to Zhang Zhung Nyengyud Dzogchen.

79 Tib. Lha rgod thog las 'bar.
80 Tib. Nam mkha' g.Yung drung.
81 Tib, 'Brug gsas Chern pa, Che mchog mKha' gying.
82 Banpo Tengyur, vol. 295, p. 23. Kindly translated by Yongdzin Rinpoche, 07.08.09, Shenten Dargye Ling, France. 83 Oral communication from Yongdzin Rinpoche.
The best meditation is no meditation

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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby kalden yungdrung » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:43 pm

Erata:

Gyerpung Nangzher Lodpo is important for another reason, too. He unified in himself all the lineages of the Zhang Zhung Nyengyud. The lineage we have been discussing so far is known as the Uninterrupted Lineage,64 so called because all the Masters in this lineage followed one after the other with no chronological breaks.

Uninterrupted Lineage must be replaced with interrupted Lineage.
The best meditation is no meditation

mutsuk
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby mutsuk » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:53 am


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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby kalden yungdrung » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:55 am

The best meditation is no meditation

mutsuk
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby mutsuk » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:14 am


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Sönam
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby Sönam » Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:31 pm

By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby Stewart » Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:36 pm

I third it...I appreciate your posts KY, but the blue font sometimes forces me to give up reading halfway through if it's a long post. Black please.
s.

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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby kalden yungdrung » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:32 pm

Tashi delek,

If it would be better for you, i will write in black, no problem at all. :D
Communication should be perfect and not difficult.

Eyes can also be sensible in case of practice, i heard so.
For instance my eyes went bad from moment to moment. Now i need reading glasses. That is also the eye and its difficulties.


Mutsog Marro
KY
The best meditation is no meditation

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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby Sönam » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:59 pm

:thumbsup:
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

Stewart
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Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 6:40 pm

Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby Stewart » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:04 pm

Thanks KY :smile:
s.

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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby kalden yungdrung » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:09 pm

The best meditation is no meditation

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Sönam
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby Sönam » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:29 pm

sorry to come back ... but now you have to learn to deal with [/quote][quote]

:hug:
Sönam
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby kalden yungdrung » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:33 pm

The best meditation is no meditation

username
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby username » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:35 pm

Thank you Kalden Yungdrung for showing Bon pay homage to all Buddhas including Shakyamuni and Garab Dorje despite what some mistaken beings propagate. ChNNR said last week in detail, sometimes those who think they are scholars will never get rigpa as it can be more difficult for them and easier for ordinary honest people though this is not an absolute rule and there are many exceptions in both camps. Of course there are great scholars like LTNR and himself who are realized masters and we have seen many times in person lecture including in universities to professors. So regarding your OP, the great scholar masters like TNR & ChNNR's views are not easily dismissed for us and also many non-practicing professors but are serious contenders. Also there are other few academically trained scholars authorized by such rare great masters to teach Dzogchen too and those are the true scholars. But your realizations above are true as is the homage paid to Padmasambhava by New Bon receiving terma from him in Kham and elsewhere to this very day. Thanks again.
Dzogchen masters I know say: 1)Buddhist religion essence is Dzogchen 2)Religions are positive by intent/fruit 3)Any method's OK unless: breaking Dzogchen vows, mixed as syncretic (Milanese Soup) 4)Don't join mandalas of opponents of Dalai Lama/Padmasambhava: False Deity inventors by encouraging victims 5)Don't debate Ati with others 6)Don't discuss Ati practices online 7) A master told his old disciple: no one's to discuss his teaching with some others on a former forum nor mention him. Publicity's OK, questions are asked from masters/set teachers in person/email/non-public forums~Best wishes

mutsuk
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby mutsuk » Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:34 am


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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby username » Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:18 am

1- I was not thinking of anyone Bon so your assumption is wrong.
2- I never thought of JLA once when writing that so you are wrong again. His criticisms of ChNNR never came to my mind.
3- The point is some don't like New Bon. They are constantly complaining about being repressed by such people to the Tibetan government in exile.

So everything you are and wrote is just your usual mental protections. Charming :)
Dzogchen masters I know say: 1)Buddhist religion essence is Dzogchen 2)Religions are positive by intent/fruit 3)Any method's OK unless: breaking Dzogchen vows, mixed as syncretic (Milanese Soup) 4)Don't join mandalas of opponents of Dalai Lama/Padmasambhava: False Deity inventors by encouraging victims 5)Don't debate Ati with others 6)Don't discuss Ati practices online 7) A master told his old disciple: no one's to discuss his teaching with some others on a former forum nor mention him. Publicity's OK, questions are asked from masters/set teachers in person/email/non-public forums~Best wishes

mutsuk
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby mutsuk » Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:02 pm


mutsuk
Posts: 571
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby mutsuk » Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:23 pm


username
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Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby username » Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:32 pm

As I did not have you or JLA in mind when writing, most of your post above is continuing your mistaken presumptions. As to the other area, you don't know what I am taking about since the complaints being received in Dharamsala regularly in confidence are from certain other quarters in Kham. Thirdly regardless of doctrinal disagreements all Tibetan sub schools have equal rights. Fourthly no one thinks you or JLA, whom you are quoting from telephone conversations in this forum, or any westerner are the source of the little problem outside Tibet. No one cares about what you guys say so do not worry. Finally since I had not you or JLA in mind in the post you attacked, the fact remains your accusation was merely your mistaken mental projection. However I will continue to read his interviews and papers and your posts and future papers too with interest. Say hello to JLA from me. Have a good day my friend :)
Dzogchen masters I know say: 1)Buddhist religion essence is Dzogchen 2)Religions are positive by intent/fruit 3)Any method's OK unless: breaking Dzogchen vows, mixed as syncretic (Milanese Soup) 4)Don't join mandalas of opponents of Dalai Lama/Padmasambhava: False Deity inventors by encouraging victims 5)Don't debate Ati with others 6)Don't discuss Ati practices online 7) A master told his old disciple: no one's to discuss his teaching with some others on a former forum nor mention him. Publicity's OK, questions are asked from masters/set teachers in person/email/non-public forums~Best wishes

mutsuk
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Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 7:35 pm

Re: Zhang Zhung and Garab Dorje

Postby mutsuk » Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:39 pm



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