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Plants ~ Borderline Beings? - Page 3 - Dhamma Wheel

Plants ~ Borderline Beings?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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retrofuturist
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Re: Plant Life

Postby retrofuturist » Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:37 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Hanzze
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Hanzze » Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:56 am

Dear retrofuturist,

are there suttas which call plants "different" forms of live? Do they not arise, exist, and dying? Are they not caught in the circle of life?
As the tree seams to be one of the most peaceful beings, nutritious so many beings, giving them a place to live, air to breath, holding the soil together that it does not get lost. Even he is such a kind of generous being, he has to struggle and fight from the birth till death. His fight may be soundless, slowly, difficult to observe, not easy to see.

In German palaces where trees are planted to grow in protection are called: "Baumschule" what could be translated as "School for trees". It may has nothing to do with it, it just came to my mind.
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

alan
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Re: Plant Life

Postby alan » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:06 am

Plants are irrelevant. Be nice to them anyway--it's good for you.

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Hanzze
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Hanzze » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:39 am

Dear alan,

irrelevant for what?
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

alan
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Re: Plant Life

Postby alan » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:45 am

Not a proper question.

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Hanzze
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Hanzze » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:02 am

Dear Alan,

in the way nibbana is translated as "without plants or forest"? Well in south east Asia the acting is mostly like that. But I dont think that your "irrelevant" was pointing in that way. I just do not remember the quote about the different between cutting the forest and cutting the forest in the mind. *searching*
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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retrofuturist
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Re: Plant Life

Postby retrofuturist » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:24 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Hanzze
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Hanzze » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:46 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ron-The-Elder
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Ron-The-Elder » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:29 am

What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

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Ron-The-Elder
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Ron-The-Elder » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:57 am

What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

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cooran
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Re: Plant Life

Postby cooran » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:14 am

---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Ron-The-Elder
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Ron-The-Elder » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:26 am

Last edited by Ron-The-Elder on Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

PeterB
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Re: Plant Life

Postby PeterB » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:08 pm


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Hanzze
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Hanzze » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:51 pm

Dear PeterB,

I can only tell what I have seen and understood by my self and I would not follow as I never did. It was just like alway: Look for your self, if it is understood right.
I dont think that retrofuturist is easy able to manipulate, he knows very well what to think of and what to ignore. It could be that I am wrong, that thanks for the hint Peter. And sorry retrofuturist, if it is that case.

One should not forget, that the western life is far, far away from nature... patient and time. If you spend some time in nature and you come to a place where trees are have been cut short time ago you also would feel that there is a lot of suffering and pain, some wood still alive.

In Theravada tradition in south east Asia, it is normaly taught that a plant higher that one meter could have a habitant (I dont know how to say, something like a ghost). That it way one request, I guess it was three days, before he cuts the wood. One could say, that it is important to give others the chance to leave there palace.
Taking what is not given is in any case wrong. To honesty request if it is real needed is a good way for laypeople I guess.

Although thanks to Ron the edler to point some things out in a much better and more useful way that I ever could.
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ron-The-Elder
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Location: Concord, New Hampshire, U.S.A.

Re: Plant Life

Postby Ron-The-Elder » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:13 pm

What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: Plant Life

Postby PeterB » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:28 pm

We can all blow smoke up each others Suttas for ever Hanzze. The facts about this and other issues were established in the Theravadin community centuries ago. We are all free to substitute our own papanca for the Teachings Of The Elders. But be in no doubt when that is what it is.

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Ron-The-Elder
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Location: Concord, New Hampshire, U.S.A.

Re: Plant Life

Postby Ron-The-Elder » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:39 pm

What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: Plant Life

Postby PeterB » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:44 pm

Last edited by PeterB on Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: Plant Life

Postby PeterB » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:47 pm


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Hanzze
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Re: Plant Life

Postby Hanzze » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:50 pm

Dear Ron-The-Elder,

is it the intension to harm or at least the intension of wanting? I guess the "intension to harm" is just a first step in the practice in the Theravada way. To practice compassion/precepts.

To day it is not easy to see the harming in a nearly perfect network of hiding the effects to force the wanting. In ancient time it or here in Cambodia you see the tree falling when you think about toilet paper and you need to cut the meat out of the pig.
In this case it is more easy to keep just the intension of not harming as you easily can see the effects. To have no intension of harming is what a novice is usually taught, but from my opinion it does not fit to "modern" society, it is simply to far away and less are there who take the real save way of leaving the house.

On the other hand, knowledge is something that is easy available so one should understand that everything is taken by nature, had caused harming on the other side of the earth.

Or mother would still continue to given, even she is hurt and cries. As long as we do not have the possibility to give something back, we should reduce the hurt on her. Not wanting more as we need is a good start to honor our mother, the nature, the plant...
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_


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