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Agganna Sutta - Page 7 - Dhamma Wheel

Agganna Sutta

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 2:49 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby son of dhamma » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:03 pm

The theory of evolution as explained by spontaneous generation. How does all this life come about? There is no evidence at all to show how even the most basic of organic cells formed on this planet. The theory of evolution doesn't mean much without something to begin it, the evidence doesn't authentically support the theory with an original root. The main theory of the origin of organic matter is spontaneous generation. Regardless, there is no evidence for the physical beginning of the biological evolutionary theory. It is all so theoretical in fact that I don't understand you're utter confidence in saying that my petty inference is definitely "not" how humans arise. Or are you a Fully Enlightened Buddha?
When I was talking about the evolving phase and using the term "evolving", I was talking about the world-system evolving, not biological processes. I don't think that the evolution of man is important. The Buddha was born as a human and taught what he taught. I think that he was Fully Enlightened.
I agree that he probably didn't know much about genetics or biochemistry, but I do think that he knew clearly how everything formed and dissolved from a human perspective. Or was he not a Fully Awakened Sammasambuddha? He wasn't merely an Arahant or Savakbuddha (from commentaries), he was distinguished among all awakened beings, a Bodhisatta.
I understand that you're not convinced that the Buddha knew how human beings arose on this world. Many Buddhists on this site seem to share this sentiment. I couldn't disagree with the idea more, no offense. And I wouldn't argue about on a Theravada forum. At all.
with metta
Sometimes no Buddhas arise in the world. Sometimes they do. When it happens, it is for the welfare and happiness of men, out of compassion for all creatures. For a long, long time he has been working to become a Buddha. He met other Buddhas along the way. And after his long striving he attains his final life, yet not without showing everyone else how to get there.

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:15 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby Lazy_eye » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:20 pm


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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:29 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby son of dhamma » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:40 pm

Sometimes no Buddhas arise in the world. Sometimes they do. When it happens, it is for the welfare and happiness of men, out of compassion for all creatures. For a long, long time he has been working to become a Buddha. He met other Buddhas along the way. And after his long striving he attains his final life, yet not without showing everyone else how to get there.

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:45 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby son of dhamma » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:55 pm

This discussion has become unhelpful. Are you not the person who originally posted the question, "what is everyone else's interpretation of this sutta?" I am thus-far only inclined to think that you care only about scientific evidence for evolution (which I agree does take place on our world), and that the Agganna Sutta has no significant value to you as a credible source for anything. You've been refuting it. I was simply attempting to explain the sutta in regard to science.
I understand that evolution via natural selection (among other processes) does occur, but to say that it does so regardless of the first cause of it. It is in COMPLETE regards to its first cause. Or are we to assume that if we looked back into history that everything would just become fuzzy, and then we would see evolution appearing out of a vacuum?
Evolution occurs. The theory of evolution as explained by any first cause has no meaning to me, because there is no clear first cause supported by scientific evidence.
My assumption, originally, was that this was the purpose of you posting the excerpt from the Agganna Sutta and posing such a question. But I was incorrect.
with metta
Sometimes no Buddhas arise in the world. Sometimes they do. When it happens, it is for the welfare and happiness of men, out of compassion for all creatures. For a long, long time he has been working to become a Buddha. He met other Buddhas along the way. And after his long striving he attains his final life, yet not without showing everyone else how to get there.

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:16 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:17 pm


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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:26 pm


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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:32 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:37 pm


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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby son of dhamma » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:53 pm

Sometimes no Buddhas arise in the world. Sometimes they do. When it happens, it is for the welfare and happiness of men, out of compassion for all creatures. For a long, long time he has been working to become a Buddha. He met other Buddhas along the way. And after his long striving he attains his final life, yet not without showing everyone else how to get there.

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:59 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby son of dhamma » Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:03 pm

Yet doesn't mean anything to science. And the day that it becomes scientifically verifiable, why would I deny it? You are clearly favoring scientific theory. I'm not favoring either side, that's my thought.
I really don't think I have anything of use to you all to say.
with metta
Sometimes no Buddhas arise in the world. Sometimes they do. When it happens, it is for the welfare and happiness of men, out of compassion for all creatures. For a long, long time he has been working to become a Buddha. He met other Buddhas along the way. And after his long striving he attains his final life, yet not without showing everyone else how to get there.

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby clw_uk » Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:06 pm

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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:10 pm


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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:15 pm


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Re: Agganna Sutta

Postby son of dhamma » Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:18 pm

I'm glad that you understand my acknowledgment. I am very discouraged by you attitude. On four of these characterized responses, you commented on my non-clarity or muddled speech. That's not necessary. I also answered that "I am a conservative disciple of the Buddhadhamma, and because I am in complete agreement with the Theravada I am thus a member of the tradition.
I don't have any value in this discussion.
I apologize if I haven't come across accordingly.
with metta
Sometimes no Buddhas arise in the world. Sometimes they do. When it happens, it is for the welfare and happiness of men, out of compassion for all creatures. For a long, long time he has been working to become a Buddha. He met other Buddhas along the way. And after his long striving he attains his final life, yet not without showing everyone else how to get there.


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