Depression & Realization

Discuss your personal experience with the Dharma here. How has it enriched your life? What challenges does it present?

Depression & Realization

Postby dakini_boi » Wed May 23, 2012 8:35 pm

Depression is described in Western medicine as a physiological condition, for which psychiatric medicine is often prescribed. Of course, it's more complicated than being purely physiological, as the way our mind works plays a role - but it seems to be a continuum, and many health professionals think that for some people, it is a real physiological limitation that requires medicine to effectively treat. Now we know that realized masters are still subject to physiological problems, and often need to be medicated. If depression can in some cases be a purely physiological condition, does anyone know if there are realized masters who must be on psychiatric medication?
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby Wayfarer » Sun May 27, 2012 10:34 am

I would be very surprised to know of 'realized masters' who suffered clinical depression, or needed psychiatric medicine. It's a contradiction. I would think a 'realized master' would understand there is nothing worth being depressed about.
Learn to do good, refrain from evil, purify the mind ~ this is the teaching of the Buddhas
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby ram peswani » Sun May 27, 2012 12:32 pm

dakini_boi wrote:Depression is described in Western medicine as a physiological condition, for which psychiatric medicine is often prescribed. Of course, it's more complicated than being purely physiological, as the way our mind works plays a role - but it seems to be a continuum, and many health professionals think that for some people, it is a real physiological limitation that requires medicine to effectively treat. Now we know that realized masters are still subject to physiological problems, and often need to be medicated. If depression can in some cases be a purely physiological condition, does anyone know if there are realized masters who must be on psychiatric medication?




Realized masters are and should be completely free from depression etc.
The path of realized master towards Buddhahood leads to perfect physical and mental body.
A Buddha has 32 special perfect physically visible features and a perfect mental bodies at the back.


In fact someone writing on Lotus sutra mentioned chapter 27. In this chapter the celesial king when he presents himself before Buddha is astounded after seeing the Buddha physically. So much so that he surrenders his celesial kingdom to follow the path of Buddhahood. Whenever a person wants to select a master, physical attributes are easy signs to judge the master.
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby Nemo » Sun May 27, 2012 2:03 pm

I've never known a High Lama with mental afflictions. Though they were all workaholics and suffered what looked like the stress realated illnesses that go with such a punishing lifestyle. Heart disease, diabetes, joint problems, etc.

They were Viras, Heroes. Special forces had nothing on these guys indomitableness. Even death could not stop them.
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby Lhug-Pa » Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:56 pm

Also, synthetic-chemical drugs would negatively affect the rTsa or Nadis.

Better to go with Tibetan Medicine or Ayurveda Medicine alongside a healthy organic diet first, and, if totally necessary, resort to contemporary western pharma as a last resort.

(Good idea to also heed Tibetan Medicine's instructions on how to not lose Ojas)

There are also many herbs like Damiana, Passionflower, etc. that might help a lot too. Or Yerba Maté and Guarana tea taken with natural DMEA and Choline. Look up Mountain Rose Herbs.

And regular exercise of course.
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby Challenge23 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 2:59 pm

jeeprs wrote:I would be very surprised to know of 'realized masters' who suffered clinical depression, or needed psychiatric medicine. It's a contradiction. I would think a 'realized master' would understand there is nothing worth being depressed about.


With respect, chemical based mental disorders don't work like that. It's not a matter of things happening which produces sadness, anxiety or whatever. It's more like a constant modification of perception that doesn't as much go away as it is managed effectively. Your brain doesn't focus on winning the Super Bowl, it focuses on the fact that you didn't catch that second pass in the first quarter.

This is very similar to anxiety which I know for a fact at least one highly realized practitioner deals with(Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, he talked about it in his first book). The only difference between the two is the nature of the overall filter that the brain puts over your perception.

In regards to realized masters it wouldn't surprise me one bit if they suffered clinical depression but managed it well enough that medicine was no longer required. The trick I've found is to be able to differentiate the "depressed" or "anxious" thoughts from the "real" thoughts.

For example, "My car needs coolant quite often. I should take it to the repair shop. It may be something minor or something serious. Either way it should get fixed." is a rational, if not unfortunate thought process. "My car needs coolant, I'm positive it is the radiator, I'm going to be without a car, soon without a job, and will die cold, lonely, and hungry." is the depression talking and should be pushed aside and ignored or "logic-ed" away.

The main difference between people who have to take medication and people who don't is the strength of the "depression talk" in one's head once you take what precautions you can to reduce the volume.
I'm an agnostic in the same sense that Robert Anton Wilson was, except his reaction was laughter. Mine isn't.

I am not a teacher in any tradition, Buddhist or otherwise. Anything that I have posted should not be taken as representing the view of anyone other than my own. And maybe Larry S. Smith of Montgomery, Alabama. But most likely just me.
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby odysseus » Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:19 pm

ram peswani wrote:
The path of realized master towards Buddhahood leads to perfect physical and mental body.
A Buddha has 32 special perfect physically visible features and a perfect mental bodies at the back.


In fact someone writing on Lotus sutra mentioned chapter 27. In this chapter the celesial king when he presents himself before Buddha is astounded after seeing the Buddha physically. So much so that he surrenders his celesial kingdom to follow the path of Buddhahood. Whenever a person wants to select a master, physical attributes are easy signs to judge the master.


It´s cool with good looking Buddhas and all, but why are so many lamas a bit chubby and Thai monks so thin? Lol! :focus:
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Re: Depression & Realization

Postby lobster » Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:14 am

You can not practice when you are depressed.
You should make use of any and all tools available.

I know of at least one suicidal rinpoche. The Buddha went through a fair bit of mental anguish . . .
This is not the same depth of experience but I once woke up depressed for (at the time) no known reason.
I already knew and had confirmed that experience is empty of form.
I literally said to all arisings, some at gut level, you are bliss, you are happy.

Even though this was not what I was feeling, in essence it was true and so I continued.
Eventually it became more true.

Take medicine. Get well if possible. :coffee:
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