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Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters - Page 5 - Dhamma Wheel

Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Casual discussion amongst spiritual friends.
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tiltbillings
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby tiltbillings » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:34 pm


PeterB
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby PeterB » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:37 pm

There is no such thing as "Buddhism" Anna.
There is the Dhamma as found in the Pali Canon. Tenzing Gyatso does not represent that.
Even he would not claim to.
It is simply not possible to square the Buddhas teaching as found in the Pali Canon with outlandish and sentimental nonsense like the idea of tulkus.
I will leave the discussion at this point as there is no possibility of agreement.

:anjali:

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tiltbillings
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby tiltbillings » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:38 pm


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Kim OHara
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While we're talking about whaling ...

Postby Kim OHara » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:52 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: While we're talking about whaling ...

Postby tiltbillings » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:54 pm


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OcTavO
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby OcTavO » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:59 pm

Last edited by OcTavO on Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby Annapurna » Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:59 pm

http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/

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tiltbillings
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby tiltbillings » Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:04 pm


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cooran
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby cooran » Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:37 pm

Amidst the ocean depths, far below the light,
A lone whale glides by in her watery flight.
A cry so lonely, a wailing of despair,
Something precious lost in the great somewhere.

Serene, yet watchful, moving always in fear
Of death's stillness, she searches ever near.
Pulling sunlight upward with care,
She caresses the surface and mists the salty air.

Nothing! Not a movement, except a hulking mass,
A predator's scent, a watchful, sweeping pass.
Dangerously taunting, the sight draws her near
As battered nets pull in Death and despair.

Her baby! Her angel! Death had claimed its song,
While a quiet stillness seemed to linger on.
Across the endless ocean, far below the sky,
A mournful mother sang a haunting lullaby.
by Cheryl Kaye Tardif
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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cooran
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby cooran » Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:47 am


By environment reporter Sarah Clarke

Seventeen mostly pro-whaling nations have had their voting rights suspended at the International Whaling Commission (IWC) meeting in Morocco, in what could be a blow to Japan's hopes of resuming commercial whaling.

Delegates at the Agadir meeting are currently engaged in secret talks in a bid to break the deadlock over proposals to allow Japan to resume a limited commercial whale hunt in exchange for a reduction in its so-called scientific whaling program in the Southern Ocean.

This morning meeting deputy chairman Anthony Liverpool said about one-fifth of the meeting's 88 member states would not be allowed to vote.
The countries include Palau, the Marshall Islands, Ghana and Gambia and are mostly drawn from the pro-whaling bloc which has been expected to back Japan's move.
They have been suspended for reasons including failing to pay their annual fees.

Solomon Islands, meanwhile, has failed to show up at the meeting.

With so many nations unable to vote, some are hopeful that the controversial plan to overturn a 24-year ban on commercial whaling will not get the numbers to pass.

Under the draft proposal, Japan would be allowed to catch 120 whales a year in its coastal waters.
The package has split the anti-whaling bloc, with Australia now at odds with some of its former allies.

The proposal needs a three-quarters majority vote to pass.

Europe could have the deciding vote, with some in the EU supporting a deal.

The meeting, held behind closed doors over the next two days, is the most controversial in years.
As well as trying to negotiate a way forward for the deadlocked organisation, the IWC is also under pressure to investigate allegations its deputy chair had his hotel bill paid for by Japan and that delegates are being offered prostitutes in return for their vote.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010 ... 933768.htm
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:34 am

what about when indigenous peoples kill whales is that different? it's an issue here where i live, one i'm undecided about, they kill baby seals too. i wouldn't mind as much if they really were just trying to keep their cultures intact but as far as i'm aware their ancestors didnt club baby seals with aluminum bats....
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

PeterB
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby PeterB » Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:28 am

Having said that I have left the thread..... :embarassed:

I dont think non- violence is " above criticism " Anna.
I can think of a dozen ways to critique it.
We need the military. We need the police. We need young women to learn to physically defend themselves.
Without violence properly managed and regulated it is unlikely that we would be living in a society where we are free to discuss the need or otherwise for violence.

In old Tibet the food animals were killed by indigenous Muslims who were then shunned as animal killers by the Buddhist population.
In just the same way "Buddhists " pay lip service to pacifism while fully enjoying the relative peace brought by the military and the police with their potential for violence against those who would disturb that peace.
The result of Gandhi.s non violence was the death of hundreds of thousands at partition.

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Annapurna
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby Annapurna » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:02 pm

In any case, anybody who is seriously against whale hunting can sign this petition here:

72 hours left:

http://www.avaaz.org/de/whales_72hrs_le ... 157&v=6679

On top of the page is a button with the English version.
http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/

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cooran
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby cooran » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:16 pm

Thanks Anna. Done!

with metta
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Annapurna
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby Annapurna » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:27 pm

Oh, dear one. :smile:

I thank you, look at the new topic.
http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/

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cooran
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby cooran » Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:18 am


By Sarah Clarke and wires


Those opposed to the proposal said it amounted to a back-door whaling ban (Australian Customs Service: File photo)

A deal at the International Whaling Commission (IWC) meeting in Morocco that would allow Japan to resume commercial whaling is dead in the water.
The official talks resumed today after two days of private negotiations.

New Zealand, the United States and some European nations supported the plan which would allow Japan to resume commercial whaling if they cut their quotas in the Antarctic waters.
But the proposal caused major divisions in the anti-whaling camp.

New Zealand's commissioner Sir Geoffrey Palmer told the meeting there was an absence of political will and the gap could not be bridged.
"We had two days of useful talks but we still haven't got a consensus resolution. There is an absence of political will to bridge the gaps and to compromise," he said.
Australia has also opposed the plan.

But the status quo means Japan will continue its so-called scientific research program, which kills around 1,000 whales a year in the Southern ocean.
Some environmental groups have given qualified support for the proposal, saying if it was not possible for now to stop all whaling, at least it should be limited.

However, it was opposed by supporters of whaling who said it amounted to a back-door ban on the practice, and by some anti-whaling campaigners who described it as a sell-out to the whaling lobby.
Japan's delegation also blamed a lack of flexibility on the proposals, which were put forward by the IWC's chairman, for sinking the talks.

"Unfortunately, there are some members who are unhappy with the chair's proposal and who do not accept it as a basis for discussions," the delegation said in a statement.
- ABC/Reuters
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010 ... ?site=news
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby beeblebrox » Sat Jun 26, 2010 4:45 pm


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Donuts Dad
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby Donuts Dad » Sun Jun 27, 2010 2:54 am

I have a great deal of respect for the Dalai Lama as a high profile advocate of non violence and Buddhist unity. However, he is also an exiled head of state and has to play politics as much as any other politician. I think his comments had nothing at all to do with whaling and very much to do with currying favor with Japanese public opinion. Before the last presidential election, those of us in the States were treated to news video featuring H H laughing and schmoozing with definitive war monger, invective-spewing John McCain. Not, I suspect, because he & McCain are buddies, but to secure a political asset should the republicans win. I don't believe, as a previous posting suggested, that the Dalai Lama is naive. I think he has shown himself to be a very shrewd politician. He certainly knows the weight given his opinions by the press and others. How these remarks fit into his agenda, who can say except for H H himself and maybe the cyber spies in Beijing.

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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby PeterB » Sun Jun 27, 2010 8:41 am

I think your analysis of the motivation for his pronouncement on the whaling protests spot-on Doughnuts Dad.
I have to disagree with you about his political statements however. A sophisticated statesman would have said nothing while appearing to say something that could be seen as agreeable to both sides.
He has a long history of walking into these situations.
Notoriously his speech in which he castigated gay sex ( on the basis that it was " unnatural and "blocked the wind channels" , sic ) then when confronted in person by an allience of gay Buddhists backed down while giggling charmingly as per.
A matter of a year or so later in teachings for the Vajrayana community he made it clear that in fact he had not changed his view at all. He has blundered frequently into a number of other areas for example his on-off espousal of vegetarianism. All this is small potatoes though in the context of his consistant misreading of the Chinese Government.... :?
It is understandible to project our aspirations on to figures that we find inspiring. The downside is that they are likely to have feet of clay. A large proportion of educated Tibetans in exile, among whom I spent quite a lot a time formerly, withdrew those projections some time ago, leaving westerners to elevate the DL to celeb status and above criticism. Well tell that to your local Kadampa or Nyingmapa, and then stand back...
This granting of celeb and icon status to the Dl in a fairly indiscriminate way by non Vajrayanists led occasionally to some blackly humorous situations on the Grey Forum. Someone would post a critical view of the DL's position vis-a-vis something or other, which would result in an emotional defense of the DL by people who had never been near Vajrayana teachings in their lives . Which was met in turn by deafening silence from the most militant Dzogchen/ Vajra people , who would not openly criticise the DL, but on the other hand would not defend him...for a number of reasons . Usually to with the internal strife that characterises the Vajrayana...... :roll:

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tiltbillings
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Re: Dalai Lama criticises anti-whaling protesters

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jul 21, 2010 5:57 am

I just watched the most recent episode of "Whale Wars," the one that precedes the boarding of the Japanese vessel. While this boarding has been decried here as being very naughty, the real real criminal action here is the deliberate ramming of a very small fragile vessel that was essentially a drift by a very large, fast moving and very agile vessel that changed course to first harrass the smaller vessel, and it then changed course to ram it. There was no reason for the large vessel to be anywhere near the smaller vessel which was almost out of fuel and waiting for refueling from another Sea Shepherd vessel. And even after the ramming the Japanese used a high pressure hose on their boat against the men that were lounging on out side of the smaller vessel. The real criminals here are the Japanese whalers.



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