Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

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Mr. G
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Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Mr. G » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:34 am

Dr Jim Valby

PURIFICATION PRACTICES IN SUTRA, TANTRA AND DZOGCHEN

October 14-16

Jim Valby attended graduate school while driving a school bus,
programming computers, teaching violin, and running a nuclear reactor.
He earned Masters and Doctorate degrees in Tibetan Buddhism focusing on
Shri Singha, Vimalamitra, and computers at the University of
Saskatchewan under Professor Herbert Guenther. In 1982, he participated
in his first retreat with Chogyal Namkhai Norbu. Since 1989, he has
lived in Western Massachusetts, near the Dzogchen Community's North
American base Tsegyalgar East, working on translations from Tibetan,
transcripts of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu retreats and other Dzogchen
Community projects.

Dorm room accommodation available for both programs at E-Vam Institute
for $25 per night (membership discounts apply)

Please send books and payments to the address below or call the office
to make a booking

E-Vam Institute | 171 Water Street, Chatham (town of Ghent), NY 12037 |
518-392-6900 | www.evam.org <http://www.evam.org/> | office@evam.org
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu

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Sönam
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Sönam » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:47 am

There is no purification practices in Dzogchen ... purifications practices belong to other yanas.

Sönam
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

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Mr. G
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Mr. G » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:59 am

Sönam wrote:There is no purification practices in Dzogchen ... purifications practices belong to other yanas.

Sönam


So there's no purification of the 6 lokas?
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu

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Karma Dondrup Tashi
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Karma Dondrup Tashi » Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:45 pm

I'm taught the three outer/lower tantras are the path of purification.

Rinpoche has referred to the "ten absences" of the Kunche Gyälpo as the equivalent of Dzogchen samaya, one of which is "there are no bhumis one has to achieve through purification."

Having said that vajra dance appears to be a six lokas practice.
I fled Him, down the nights and down the days; I fled Him, down the arches of the years; I fled Him, down the labyrinthine ways, Of my own mind; and in the mist of tears, I hid from Him, and under running laughter. Up vistaed hopes I sped; And shot, precipitated, Adown Titanic glooms of chasmèd fears, From those strong Feet that followed, followed after. But with unhurrying chase, And unperturbèd pace, Deliberate speed, majestic instancy, They beat - and a Voice beat - More instant than the Feet - ‘All things betray thee, who betrayest Me.’

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Malcolm
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Malcolm » Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:51 pm

Sönam wrote:There is no purification practices in Dzogchen ... purifications practices belong to other yanas.

Sönam



Of course there are purification practices in Dzogchen, very many in fact. Vajrasattva, etc.
Atikosha
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Malcolm
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Malcolm » Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:53 pm

Karma Dondrup Tashi wrote:I'm taught the three outer/lower tantras are the path of purification.

Rinpoche has referred to the "ten absences" of the Kunche Gyälpo as the equivalent of Dzogchen samaya, one of which is "there are no bhumis one has to achieve through purification."

Having said that vajra dance appears to be a six lokas practice.


ChNN teaches purification practices like the Longsal Ngondro.

N
Atikosha
Tibetan Medicine Blog
Sudarsana Mandala, Tibetan Medicine and Herbs
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


So called “sentient beings” are merely delusions self-appearing from the dhātu of luminosity.

-- Ju Mipham

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Sönam
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Sönam » Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:03 pm

Namdrol wrote:
Sönam wrote:There is no purification practices in Dzogchen ... purifications practices belong to other yanas.

Sönam



Of course there are purification practices in Dzogchen, very many in fact. Vajrasattva, etc.


Vajrasattva and others does not "belong" to Dzogchen, also Dzogchenpa can practice it ... the only "purification" I can imagine is reactualisation. We are back to Garab Dorje's Three Precepts.

... or ?

Sönam
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

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Malcolm
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Malcolm » Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:05 pm

Sönam wrote:
Namdrol wrote:
Sönam wrote:There is no purification practices in Dzogchen ... purifications practices belong to other yanas.

Sönam



Of course there are purification practices in Dzogchen, very many in fact. Vajrasattva, etc.


Vajrasattva and others does not "belong" to Dzogchen, also Dzogchenpa can practice it ... the only "purification" I can imagine is reactualisation. We are back to Garab Dorje's Three Precepts.

... or ?

Sönam


Or all the purification practices recommended in the Dzogchen man ngag sde tantras such as Vajrasattva practice, prostrations, mandala, Guru Yoga, etc., you name it., they are all there.

Norbu Rinpoche said it best "There is no such thing as pure Dzogchen".

N
Atikosha
Tibetan Medicine Blog
Sudarsana Mandala, Tibetan Medicine and Herbs
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


So called “sentient beings” are merely delusions self-appearing from the dhātu of luminosity.

-- Ju Mipham

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conebeckham
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby conebeckham » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:10 am

Oh yeah, Namdrol? How about this....

"Vajrasattva is pure Dzogchen."

:thinking:


I dare anyone to argue that statement.

(I'm sure someone will, though...such is the nature of Internet Forums, even those that are pure from the beginning...)

Sorry, couldn't resist.
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."

May any merit generated by on-line discussion
Be dedicated to the Ultimate Benefit of All Sentient Beings.

Josef
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Re: Purification Practices in Sutra, Tantra & Dzogchen

Postby Josef » Thu Jul 28, 2011 1:17 am

Sönam wrote:
Namdrol wrote:
Sönam wrote:There is no purification practices in Dzogchen ... purifications practices belong to other yanas.

Sönam



Of course there are purification practices in Dzogchen, very many in fact. Vajrasattva, etc.


Vajrasattva and others does not "belong" to Dzogchen, also Dzogchenpa can practice it ... the only "purification" I can imagine is reactualisation. We are back to Garab Dorje's Three Precepts.

... or ?

Sönam


Purification of the elements.
Purification of the six lokas.

Lots of different Dzogchen purification practices.


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