Dharma Wheel on Dharma Wheel....

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Dharma Wheel on Dharma Wheel....

Postby Fruitzilla » Sun Jan 15, 2012 10:06 pm

Thread Split from: banned from zenforuminternational...

Namdrol wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:
Namdrol wrote:One thing people really don't undertand is that I virtually had no hand in making the policies of E-Sangha.

I was just a convientient person to blame.

N


I have no insight into the internal affairs of the moderating team.
You did seems pretty pivotal in the prevailing culture over there though.


No more so than here.

The fact is that E-sangha was too big, and trying to wear too many hats, being everything to everyone. The fact that it fell apart and reconstituted itself into three separate forums completely makes sense.

N


Well, you're pretty pivotal here also it looks like. A bit more over at e-sangha even. As far as I can remember at least.

But the three forums do make a lot of sense, indeed.

Funny that there's a Theravada, a Mahayana(actually mostly Vajrayana) and a Zen forum by the way. Three pretty different interpretations/temperaments it seems.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Sun Jan 15, 2012 11:07 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:
Well, you're pretty pivotal here also it looks like.


The overall policies of this forum were, and are setup by the Owner, Founders, Administrators, and Moderators. Namdrol assisted in setting up the initial policies for the Tibetan Medicine sub-forum as he is the Tibetan Medicine Lead.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Malcolm » Sun Jan 15, 2012 11:20 pm

Mr. G wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:
Well, you're pretty pivotal here also it looks like.


The overall policies of this forum were, and are setup by the Owner, Founders, Administrators, and Moderators. Namdrol assisted in setting up the initial policies for the Tibetan Medicine sub-forum as he is the Tibetan Medicine Lead.



Right, I have no role at all otherwise.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Fruitzilla » Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:07 am

Mr. G wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:
Well, you're pretty pivotal here also it looks like.


The overall policies of this forum were, and are setup by the Owner, Founders, Administrators, and Moderators. Namdrol assisted in setting up the initial policies for the Tibetan Medicine sub-forum as he is the Tibetan Medicine Lead.


I know this. If you read back a bit, you will see I am talking about culture, not policy.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:08 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:I know this. If you read back a bit, you will see I am talking about culture, not policy.


I don't see what you're talking about. What culture would that be?
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Fruitzilla » Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:02 pm

Mr. G wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:I know this. If you read back a bit, you will see I am talking about culture, not policy.


I don't see what you're talking about. What culture would that be?


The culture of the Dharma Wheel forum. There's a steady group of regular posters here, who determine what gets talked about and what intellectual positions are deemed more or less acceptable. A lot of those posters are students of Namkhai Norbu.
Namdrol, being a senior student, who is looked up to by a lot of those posters and with a high posting frequency plays a big role in determining that culture.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:45 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:The culture of the Dharma Wheel forum. There's a steady group of regular posters here, who determine what gets talked about and what intellectual positions are deemed more or less acceptable.


This is absolutely not true. No Owner, Founder, Admin, moderator or Namdrol censors or ditctates what positions are allowable or not unless it is disruptive to the forum. This is why we have 30 page threads debating rebirth and karma. This is why we have 78 page threads on vegetarianism. This is wny we have numerous threads discussing why certain members prefer Chan over Vajrayana, or Dzogchen over Tantra, etc.

A lot of those posters are students of Namkhai Norbu.
Namdrol, being a senior student, who is looked up to by a lot of those posters and with a high posting frequency plays a big role in determining that culture.


You can't correlate that because the majority of posters on this forum are Tibetan Buddhists, that there is some subversive cultural change taking place. There are many threads where members like Astus, Huseng, Jnana, Hui Feng, Anders Honore, and Namdrol have civil discussions on the finer points of Buddhist tenets. I personally think it would be great to have more discussion in the Zen, Pure Land, Tendai, Shingon and Nichiren sub-forums. However if practitioners from those traditions don't post here, we can't corral and force them to come to this forum.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Jnana » Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:39 pm

Mr. G wrote:I personally think it would be great to have more discussion in the Zen, Pure Land, Tendai, Shingon and Nichiren sub-forums. However if practitioners from those traditions don't post here, we can't corral and force them to come to this forum.

Indeed, it would be a good thing. Hopefully, in time more will come and share.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:59 pm

Jnana wrote:
Mr. G wrote:I personally think it would be great to have more discussion in the Zen, Pure Land, Tendai, Shingon and Nichiren sub-forums. However if practitioners from those traditions don't post here, we can't corral and force them to come to this forum.

Indeed, it would be a good thing. Hopefully, in time more will come and share.


Yup, I'm keeping a positive attitude that they will.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Fruitzilla » Mon Jan 16, 2012 3:50 pm

Mr. G wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:The culture of the Dharma Wheel forum. There's a steady group of regular posters here, who determine what gets talked about and what intellectual positions are deemed more or less acceptable.


This is absolutely not true. No Owner, Founder, Admin, moderator or Namdrol censors or ditctates what positions are allowable or not unless it is disruptive to the forum. This is why we have 30 page threads debating rebirth and karma. This is why we have 78 page threads on vegetarianism. This is wny we have numerous threads discussing why certain members prefer Chan over Vajrayana, or Dzogchen over Tantra, etc.


I said determine, not censor or dictate. When I go train at my aikido dojo, people don't talk about boxing or fencing at all, jodo and karate are mentioned a bit more. Nobody is going to say European swords are superior to Japanese. This is the kind of thing I mean.

A lot of those posters are students of Namkhai Norbu.
Namdrol, being a senior student, who is looked up to by a lot of those posters and with a high posting frequency plays a big role in determining that culture.


You can't correlate that because the majority of posters on this forum are Tibetan Buddhists, that there is some subversive cultural change taking place. There are many threads where members like Astus, Huseng, Jnana, Hui Feng, Anders Honore, and Namdrol have civil discussions on the finer points of Buddhist tenets. I personally think it would be great to have more discussion in the Zen, Pure Land, Tendai, Shingon and Nichiren sub-forums. However if practitioners from those traditions don't post here, we can't corral and force them to come to this forum.


Again, I never said or meant subversive, just cultural. Buddhist "modernists" would fit badly in this culture for example, so the chance of one sticking around here for a time are pretty slim.
So, I think I can actually correlate that.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby plwk » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:00 pm

I personally think it would be great to have more discussion in the Zen, Pure Land, Tendai, Shingon and Nichiren sub-forums. However if practitioners from those traditions don't post here, we can't corral and force them to come to this forum.

Image

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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Malcolm » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:24 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:Again, I never said or meant subversive, just cultural. Buddhist "modernists" would fit badly in this culture for example, so the chance of one sticking around here for a time are pretty slim.
So, I think I can actually correlate that.


They wold fit badly if they expected people to simply roll over and not challenge any of their views.

I love it when "Buddhist" modernists feel they have an absolute right to challenge any Buddhist idea they like, but get so offended when their own modernist biases and irrationalities are called into question.

N
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:32 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:I said determine, not censor or dictate. When I go train at my aikido dojo, people don't talk about boxing or fencing at all, jodo and karate are mentioned a bit more. Nobody is going to say European swords are superior to Japanese. This is the kind of thing I mean.


I understand what you're saying. I studied martial arts for about 14 years and was a former assistant instructor in Wing Chun. However, I also trained in other styles that were less traditional like JKD, Pekiti-Tirsia, Sayoc Kali - and there was plenty of discussions on the positive and negative technical aspects of other martial arts. Those schools that drew in that type of discussion were much better prepared to deal with real life situations. Dharma debate and discussion also enables one to evolve in their thinking.

Again, I never said or meant subversive, just cultural. Buddhist "modernists" would fit badly in this culture for example, so the chance of one sticking around here for a time are pretty slim.


Well, like anything - people like what they hear and stick around. Others don't like what they hear and may come across a point they haven't thought about and change their minds. Some just don't like what they hear and leave. Some don't like what they hear and stick around regardless. It is what it is. It's no different than any other forum.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:37 pm

plwk wrote:Image

Om Meow Meow Meow Meow Meow Svaha (Seven times a day for seven days)


Are you sure this works? :lol:
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:41 pm

Namdrol wrote:They wold fit badly if they expected people to simply roll over and not challenge any of their views.

I love it when "Buddhist" modernists feel they have an absolute right to challenge any Buddhist idea they like, but get so offended when their own modernist biases and irrationalities are called into question.

N


:good:
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Fruitzilla » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:43 pm

Namdrol wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:Again, I never said or meant subversive, just cultural. Buddhist "modernists" would fit badly in this culture for example, so the chance of one sticking around here for a time are pretty slim.
So, I think I can actually correlate that.


They wold fit badly if they expected people to simply roll over and not challenge any of their views.

I love it when "Buddhist" modernists feel they have an absolute right to challenge any Buddhist idea they like, but get so offended when their own modernist biases and irrationalities are called into question.

N


Mostly they don't mind so much as far as I remember.
But I know that as soon as I (for example) would start talking about rebirth being metaphorical instead of literal, or what have you, some people would immediately get on my case, and wouldn't stop hounding me until I cried uncle...
It's not a very pleasant situation to be in to be honest, so I can imagine someone with these viewpoints not getting into a habit of posting here frequently.
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Virgo » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:50 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:It's not a very pleasant situation to be in to be honest, so I can imagine someone with these viewpoints not getting into a habit of posting here frequently.

And?

Kevin
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Fruitzilla » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:53 pm

Virgo wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:It's not a very pleasant situation to be in to be honest, so I can imagine someone with these viewpoints not getting into a habit of posting here frequently.

And?

Kevin


Just thinking out loud, no and in sight....
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Mr. G » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:55 pm

Fruitzilla wrote:But I know that as soon as I (for example) would start talking about rebirth being metaphorical instead of literal, or what have you, some people would immediately get on my case, and wouldn't stop hounding me until I cried uncle...
It's not a very pleasant situation to be in to be honest, so I can imagine someone with these viewpoints not getting into a habit of posting here frequently.


Fruitzilla, are you saying you should be able to make statements on this forum that are not subject to discussion or debate?
    How foolish you are,
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    - Vasubandhu
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Re: banned from zenforuminternational...

Postby Fruitzilla » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:57 pm

Mr. G wrote:
Fruitzilla wrote:But I know that as soon as I (for example) would start talking about rebirth being metaphorical instead of literal, or what have you, some people would immediately get on my case, and wouldn't stop hounding me until I cried uncle...
It's not a very pleasant situation to be in to be honest, so I can imagine someone with these viewpoints not getting into a habit of posting here frequently.


Fruitzilla, are you saying you should be able to make statements on this forum that are not subject to discussion or debate?


Nope! That would be rather silly, no?
I'm saying that if my statements are constantly called into question, I might lose interest in making them.
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