Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

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Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby LastLegend » Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:07 pm

How do you understand Buddha Nature/Mind in relation to matter?

Please share in your own understanding so that others and I can learn from you.
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby Nosta » Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:45 pm

Can you specify more your question and what you pretend exactly? I am not sure if i understood your question.

But matter may be affected by our toughts.

Quantic theory (more than a theory, the "theory" word is not exact when applied to quantic science) says some incredible things that we may use to understand buddhism and vice versa:
- our toughts affect particles: some experiments can be only explained if we accept that our choices (and thus, our toughts) can affect things. I will not enter in details, but some scientists think thats the only solution to explain some behaviours that particles show on some experiments. Of course, the ultra materialistic scientists created a lie to themselves, and so we have now the Heisenberg Principle: a brilliant way to deny reality.

- things are interconect even we think ther arent. The Aspect Experiment (Aspect, is a name of a scientist) proved that to some extent. They divided a particle in 2 and one of the parts was send away in one direction and the other in the opposite direction. Then, if they change, lets say, the polarization of one of the parts, imeddiatly we would see the other half reacting in accordance.

We could say more things, but this are important enough to see that even science will confirm what we already knew through buddhism.
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby LastLegend » Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:53 pm

How do you understand Buddha Nature in relation to this physical realm of existence of living beings and non-living beings?
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby conebeckham » Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:55 pm

I do not understand Buddha Nature/Mind in relation to matter at all, really.

Buddhism is not really concerned with "how the external world exists," despite a lot of discussion about exactly this issue. It is soteriological in nature, ultimately.
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby LastLegend » Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:04 pm

conebeckham wrote:I do not understand Buddha Nature/Mind in relation to matter at all, really.

Buddhism is not really concerned with "how the external world exists," despite a lot of discussion about exactly this issue. It is soteriological in nature, ultimately.


May I open the discussion by asking you what Dependent Origination talks about?
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby Sherab Dorje » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:27 pm

LastLegend wrote:May I open the discussion by asking you what Dependent Origination talks about?
I was under the impression that it describes the arising and maintanence of suffering on all levels, what's your take on the matter?
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby conebeckham » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:37 pm

Matter is conditioned phenomena, and empty. It is illusory. It appears to sentient beings, and is subject to dependant origination, as are sentient beings.

Buddha Nature is unconditioned, and empty. It is Ultimate. It is the essential nature of sentient beings, but is not subject to causes and conditions.
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby LastLegend » Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:28 pm

conebeckham wrote:Matter is conditioned phenomena, and empty. It is illusory. It appears to sentient beings, and is subject to dependant origination, as are sentient beings.

Buddha Nature is unconditioned, and empty. It is Ultimate. It is the essential nature of sentient beings, but is not subject to causes and conditions.


How do you understand Buddha Nature in terms of Pure Land?
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby conebeckham » Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:48 pm

The same way I understand it here, in impure lands. :shrug:
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby LastLegend » Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:02 pm

conebeckham wrote:The same way I understand it here, in impure lands. :shrug:


:smile:
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby ram peswani » Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:59 am

LastLegend wrote:How do you understand Buddha Nature/Mind in relation to matter?

Please share in your own understanding so that others and I can learn from you.


I may or May not be right.....but i try

Scientists found that two globes appear ( i named them Shiva and Shakti).
These both are cosmic energies.
Shiva is ego
Shakti is emotions, desires etc.
Shiva is male
Shakti is female

Separation of both these cosmic energies happens with Shiva (ego) force and Shakti appears. Shiva produces this Shakti for entertainment and service
And its counter forces are gravity and light.
If one knows a little bit of science than one knows that all physical matter and elements are product of light
Depending upon the thought intensity of the desires or emotions of Shakti the light gets wrapped round itself and forms different elements
Present human beings contain both these cosmic energies and matter
Shiva and Shakti can slowly merge in a human being by awareness and the result can be seen by changes in physical body
Male has more of Shiva and female has more of Shakti.
A perfect male is Egoist and a perfect female is the one who serves and entertains the Shiva and is totally happy to do this.
Shakti can merge in Shiva when Shiva wants her to merge by awareness without any feeling or emotions
Shakti cannot do this and hence door of Buddha is not available to her :stirthepot:
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:19 am

Imaginative and entertaining but definitely not Buddhism.
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby ram peswani » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:08 pm

gregkavarnos wrote:Imaginative and entertaining but definitely not Buddhism.
:namaste:



Please read Code name God, and you will understand that all i talk is only Buddhism and nothing else. Lotus sutra is all evolution. Cause and Effect my friend. Mean while wait till you are definate, it is too early a comment.
:smile:
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby Mr. G » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:29 pm

ram peswani wrote:
gregkavarnos wrote:Imaginative and entertaining but definitely not Buddhism.
:namaste:



Please read Code name God, and you will understand that all i talk is only Buddhism and nothing else. Lotus sutra is all evolution. Cause and Effect my friend. Mean while wait till you are definate, it is too early a comment.
:smile:


Hi Ram,

Can you provide a brief synopsis of "Code Name God" and how it is related to Buddhism?
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby ram peswani » Sun Mar 27, 2011 6:05 am

mr. gordo wrote:
ram peswani wrote:
gregkavarnos wrote:Imaginative and entertaining but definitely not Buddhism.
:namaste:



Please read Code name God, and you will understand that all i talk is only Buddhism and nothing else. Lotus sutra is all evolution. Cause and Effect my friend. Mean while wait till you are definate, it is too early a comment.





Code name God

This book is diveded in two sections.

1... It is autobiography of personal experiences. Most important lesson he learnt is th power of imagination or thought. As a child he met Mahatma Gandhi who gave him the first lesson on power of thought.

Later he saw Gandhi getting freedom from powerful britishers for Indians who had no weapons by the method of non violence.

Gandhi provoked public to use charkha( a slow old machine which produces thread from cotton and takes days to produce enough thread to make one meter of cloth) because our slavery makes use of english factories to make clothes for us and take away our wealth and keeps us poor and ignorant.

Every person will produce a lot of effort in producing meager thread but with a thought behind this that i am doing this to getting freedom from britishers. And he saw India getting freedom.
He was very poor and half his family had died due to lack of food, because britishers had created a famine situation in their part of land to punish them. They were followers on Gandhi. His grandmother went hungry and fed him her share of food to save him while she died.

Then he realised the Truth of Mahatma Gandhi and beleived it totally.
Gandhi had learned this lesoon from "Gita" a very sacred book of Hindu religion.

At that time he was 12 years old.

He took a vow that he will put all his energy every moment of his life on the thought that he will become richest person in the world.

Later he studied hard, and became a leading scientist in America.
He discovered use of Laser beams, earned lot a money. Bought richest properties. Had famous holiwood actress"s as his companions. Bought 3or 4 best buglows in richest and best area of America. Threw parties and had 2-3 presidents of America as his guests
Also he had a bunch of the famous and successful scientists of his time
as his friends.


2...He realised that riches, beautiful women were not making him happy.
And as a he was baffled by thought power as a lesson from Gita. So it bacame a burning topic with his scientists friends and it led to discussion on how scientists are able to search the history and birth and evolution of our galaxy.

He went into minute details, got details and methods of this research and then wrote them in second half of the book,in simple language for common educated man. In the end the book says that there is extreme intelligence in the black hole ( source of our galaxy). If that intellegence had even one billionth billionth of error, our universe would have had a runaways or collapsed and gone for ever.
Scientists said that we do not have enough senses other than our mind which can go inside this black hole. This book also writes about quantam mechanics (it gives effect of indivitual mind) and theory of relativity which explains limitation of space and its bending and time elongaation and contraction

My brief and yet not that explanation is still not sufficients . That is why advice two books from him. second book is Cosmic Detective.


:smile:


Hi Ram,

Can you provide a brief synopsis of "Code Name God" and how it is related to Buddhism?
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby ram peswani » Sun Mar 27, 2011 6:31 am

gregkavarnos wrote:Imaginative and entertaining but definitely not Buddhism.
:namaste:



Lotus sutra also talks about the power of imagination of Purna in chapter 8. It says how Purna with his perfect knowledge of Suniata is creating a universe which will have flying men and no diseasses and suffeerings etc.

Pl read it
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby Sherab Dorje » Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:08 am

ram peswani wrote:...about the power of imagination of Purna in chapter 8. It says how Purna with his perfect knowledge of Suniata is creating a universe which will have flying men and no diseasses and suffeerings etc.
It says NOTHING about the power of imagination. Chapter eight is Shakyamuni Buddhas prediction of Purnas enlightenment and subsequent manifestation of a pure land.
All of you Bhikshus listen well,
The path walked by the Buddhas sons,
Because they thoroughly studied the expedient devices,
Was inconceivable.
Knowing that the multitudes delight in lesser Dharmas,
And also that they fear great wisdom,
Therefore the Bodhisattvas
Become Sound Hearers and Conditioned Enlightened Ones.
Employing countless expedient devices,
They transform all the varieties of living beings.
They speak of themselves as being Sound Hearers,
Very far from the Path of the Buddha.
They cross over limitless multitudes,
Bringing them all to accomplishment.
Even those of little zeal and who are remiss
Are gradually caused to become Buddhas.
Inwardly they practice as Bodhisattvas,
While outwardly they manifest as Sound Hearers
Of few desires, who despise birth and death,
While in reality they are purifying their Buddhalands.
Displaying to the multitudes the Three Poisons,
Appearing to have deviant views
In this way my disciples,
Expediently save living beings.
Were I to speak fully,
Of their various deeds of transformation
Living beings, hearing it,
Would harbor doubts within their minds.

Now, this Purnamaitreyaniputra,
In the past under thousands of millions of Buddhas,
Has cultivated diligently his practice of the Path
Proclaiming and protecting the Dharma of all the Buddhas.
Seeking supreme wisdom,
In the presence of the Buddhas,
He appeared as the head of the disciples.
With much learning and with wisdom
He spoke without fear,
Leading the assembly to rejoice,
And never did he grow weary,
Participating in the Buddhas work.
Having already crossed over into great spiritual penetrations,
And having perfected the Four Unobstructed Wisdoms,
He knew the faculties of beings, sharp or dull,
And always spoke pure Dharma.
Proclaiming principles such as this,
He taught thousands of millions of multitudes,
To dwell in the Dharma of the Great Vehicle,
While he purified his own Buddhaland.
In the future, too, he will make offerings,
To limitless, countless Buddhas,

Helping to proclaim the Proper Dharma,
And also purifying his own Buddhaland
Always using expedient devices,
he will speak the Dharma without fear,
Saying incalculable multitudes,
So that they accomplish All-Wisdom.

Having made offerings to Thus Come Ones
And protected and upheld the precious storehouse of Dharma,
He will then become a Buddha
By the name Dharma Brightness.

His country will be named "Well-Purified", made of the seven jewels.
The aeon will be named "Jeweled Brightness."

The host of Bodhisattvas, very great,
Will entirely fill that land,
Numbering in the limitless millions,
All with great spiritual penetrations,
And the perfect power of awesome virtue;
The Sound Hearers also will be countless.
Having the Three Clarities and the Eight Liberations
And the Four Unobstructed Wisdoms,
They will constitute the Sangha there.
The living beings in that land,
Will have all severed sexual desire,
Born purely from transformation,
Their bodies adorned with perfect marks.
Taking Dharma-joy and Dharma-happiness as food,
They will have no thoughts of other kinds of food.
There will be no women there,
Nor any of the evil paths.

The Bhikshu Purna
Having perfected his virtue
Will gain such a pure land,
With a host of very many worthy sages.
Such are the limitless things of which
I have now but spoken in a general way.

There is nothing there about black holes, shakti and shiva, globes, etc…
AND there is nothing there saying that women cannot achieve enlightenment. Actually in the twelfth chapter of the Lotus Sutra there are a number of verses about the Dragon Kings Daughter that it seems you overlooked:
While the Bodhisattvas, Sound Hearers, gods, dragon, and the rest of the Eightfold Division, both humans and non-humans in the Saha world all watched from a distance as the Dragon Girl became a Buddha and spoke the Dharma for all the gods and humans, they rejoiced exceedingly and reverently made obeisance from afar. Hearing that Dharma, limitless living beings understood and awoke, attaining to irreversibility. Countless living beings received predictions of the Way. The world without filth quaked in six ways, while in the Saha world, three thousand living beings came to dwell on the ground of irreversibility, and three thousand living beings brought forth the BodhI mind and gained predictions.
:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Buddha Nature/Mind (not the 6th consciousness)

Postby Madeliaette » Sun Mar 27, 2011 2:12 pm

How do you understand Buddha Nature/Mind in relation to matter?


HOW DO - by contemplating what I already know and seeing if further meaning arises

YOU UNDERSTAND BUDDHA NATURE/MIND - I separate my mental functions into:
* 'thinking mind' (thought and garbled chattering - everyday, general, conscious mind - the 'regular' mental level in daily use when not meditating/practicing)
* 'emotional mind' (feelings, emotions, etc - subconcious mind - usually reachable but not foremost in conventional people who have no depth of meditation/practice)
* 'sensing mind' (empathy, ESP, awareness of others' needs & emotions - also subconscious mind)
* 'know mind' (wisdom, natural-pure and unafflicted level, origin of Buddha mind, universal 'knowing' mind - unconcious mind - usually hidden unless in deep meditation or well-practiced person)

IN RELATION TO MATTER - I don't relate it to 'matter' as such - I simply try to reach and retain use of that level for as long as that b-word ( :oops: ) think mind of mine will let me!
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