kirtu wrote:There is an online blog of a family that says that they need about 5 acres for their whole family which can't be right. My father's extended family had a horse farm and a small garden that feed numerous people (during the First Great Drepression it feed my father, his Grandmother, a Great Aunt and several other relatives) and I used to help in that garden as a boy. It was much, much less than an acre (1 acre is about a US football field without the endzones - this garden was about 4000 sq ft). With a greenhouse setup it could be cultivated year round.
kirtu wrote:So some of what I hope will culminate in small Buddhist communities in the West could be loosely defined as a commune but this term has some conceptual overlays that don't really fit the concept. Our consumer society functions as an immense cargo cult and threatens to totally dehumanize people and turn them into instruments of production and consumption at the mercy of their ignorance.
We can form little communities, either out in the middle of no where or in cities and towns just to live our lives. If people want to use their place as a retreat then that's fine. If not then that's fine. But the places would have to be places where debt is not created (so everything is paid for), where one could establish a little temple, shrine places, and perhaps also create small industry to benefit people and animals outside the community (software development, green tech development, education, veterinary/health clinics, etc.). Also it would be best to generate one's own power as much as possible. So a kind of Buddhist Walden Pond but with as much self-sufficiency as possible (so also not unlike the old Shaker communities).
Some of these could in fact be created right in the middle of cities and towns currently.
Huseng wrote:When I was in rural Japan at a self-sufficient temple I had the experience of rice agriculture. That is back breaking labour. However, I was surprised that such a small plot of land could produce hundreds of kilos of rice.
Heruka wrote:why not a yearly summertime gar, we could rent/or for free, use a field, pitch tents and invite teachers to come and give teachings, empowerments, pujas and so forth?
a buddhapalooza of sorts but without the materialism.
we need more of a network of practioners, rather than any organized group.
kirtu wrote:we need more of a network of practioners, rather than any organized group.
How does this differ from how things are at present?
Heruka wrote:we talk of communities and so forth, but how many practioners here even offer to put up over night a fellow buddhist, travelling to an event, a pilgrimage somewhere?
Huifeng wrote:Heruka wrote:we talk of communities and so forth, but how many practioners here even offer to put up over night a fellow buddhist, travelling to an event, a pilgrimage somewhere?
The monastery where I'm staying at present has four guests, and five resident monastics.
Two guests are visiting for a couple of weeks from Malaysia, another monastic is here on a stop over from Taiwan, and the fourth is a resident of several months while he volunteers at our other monastery in Kowloon and studies at the Buddhist college on weekends.
The door is always open, and people come and go. The monastery belongs to every living being, the resident monastics are merely looking after the place for them.
But your question is a good point: If we can't have the attitude of communitas towards fellow beings in general, the idea of having some Buddhist utopia or alternative community on a larger scale and long term, is out of the question.
This is why earlier in this thread I said that the hardware is the easy part, the spiritual maturity to provide a place for other beings, be able to share that, is a much more important issue.
Nemo wrote:Mansion sized house is about 35k out in the provinces.
Cambodia would be even cheaper. You could live like a king. Worth it for the occasional bout of Delhi belly.
kirtu wrote:Nemo wrote:Mansion sized house is about 35k out in the provinces.
I have < 35k and it appears that I have been permanently locked out of the job market so what I have in the bank now is probably approximately what I have to survive on for many years.Cambodia would be even cheaper. You could live like a king. Worth it for the occasional bout of Delhi belly.
The Cambodians killed each other off in my personal memory. One of my classmates was killed in the killing fields.
I can't go to Nepal or India as a long term solution because you have to leave the country for the year after 5-6 months because of the new visa restrictions.
The ideal thing in North America, if it is doable, is to create a Buddhist yogic community where people can creatively express themselves and create or collaborate So it's not s on their own projects while maintaining a place that they can do intense retreat if they like. So it's not secular as a focus but people can work as necessary and do retreat when they wish or need to. So not just secular and not just practice but a balance (although if people wanted to do life retreat then that should be possible too).
So in the immediate range, ideally I need to find a place for myself that I can then open up to others. I pitched this back on eSangha and I think here as: let's buy land and start a Dharmic civilization.
Namdrol wrote:If you put $20,000 into a Thaibank, you can get a permanent resident visa if you are over fifty. You can easily live on your Social Security in Thailand.
kirtu wrote:Namdrol wrote:If you put $20,000 into a Thaibank, you can get a permanent resident visa if you are over fifty. You can easily live on your Social Security in Thailand.
That's good to know but SS is a ways in the future and I now have < 20,000 anyway. Had I known that after I had to sell my condo then I might have done that.