Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

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Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby tigerh98 » Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:45 am

My b-day is 4-6-98 when im 18 im going to china to become a buddhist monk how can i become a buddhist monk in china what are the requirements?what are temples i can join in beijing or some where else in china?
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Indrajala » Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:00 am

It is highly unrealistic to seek ordination and to stay in China.

Best go to Taiwan.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Alfredo » Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:21 am

What he said. Also, take some time to think about it. Get a university education. (You can do this very well in Taiwan, if you want, and it might be free.) Learn Chinese, take some religion courses. Attend Buddhist retreats during the holidays, see if you like this kind of life.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Huifeng » Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:20 pm

tigerh98 wrote:My b-day is 4-6-98 when im 18 im going to china to become a buddhist monk how can i become a buddhist monk in china what are the requirements?what are temples i can join in beijing or some where else in china?


Will I definitely admire your aspiration, to be straight with you, unless you're a Chinese citizen, I believe it's actually illegal for you to formally ordain in the People's Republic of China.

If you like the Chinese tradition, however, the best place by far would be Taiwan, ie. the Republic of China. But, even then, the best way is to first study at a Buddhist College associated with a good monastery. Then, if all works out, they may accept an application for ordination.

It'll take a lot of hard work, but if you have the aspiration, you can do it!

~~ (Ven.) Huifeng
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby tigerh98 » Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:21 pm

-_- i live in the usa and yes i want to be a buddhist monk all my life no i dont want taiwan to.be my location why u guys saying i cannot become a monk in china a visa for staying.in china for ever?
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Anders » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:00 pm

Why is it important for it to be PRoC rather than RoC? It's Chinese Buddhism in any case. The latter wasn't bulldozed by a cultural revolution either.

I understand the desire and all, but look into it a bit more and see if it won't meet your needs after all.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Alfredo » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:21 am

why u guys saying i cannot become a monk in china a visa for staying.in china for ever?


coz. that illegal 4 4ners
what u nvr heard of communism?

I probably shouldn't even mention this, but technically speaking, it might be possible to give up your citizenship (I assume American) and apply for PRC nationality. If this sounds like a good idea to you, then please hit yourself.

Out of curiosity, what specifically draws you to China?
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Indrajala » Sat Oct 19, 2013 3:36 am

tigerh98 wrote:-_- i live in the usa and yes i want to be a buddhist monk all my life no i dont want taiwan to.be my location why u guys saying i cannot become a monk in china a visa for staying.in china for ever?


As it presently stands, you cannot realistically become a monk in China. You could in theory take ordination elsewhere and stay in China on a tourist visa, but that would require some sort of connections to monasteries in China.

Taiwan is really your only viable option.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby uan » Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:42 am

tigerh98 wrote:My b-day is 4-6-98 when im 18 im going to china to become a buddhist monk how can i become a buddhist monk in china what are the requirements?what are temples i can join in beijing or some where else in china?


Vens. Indrajala and Huifeng speak conventional wisdom and are more than likely correct. But I'll give you a bit of unconventional wisdom. From personal experience, weird Buddha stuff goes on in China all the time. Laws are a bit more flexible there and guanxi (connections) trumps a lot of things. No one knows the future or what the future holds. From a Buddhist perspective, the future doesn't exist. There is only the now.

If you want to go to China when you are 18 to become a monk, there are a couple of things you can tangibly do today that can help you -- first, learn to speak and read and most importantly, write, Chinese. Spend an hour or two hours a day, every day, learning Chinese. Work on establishing your connections. Many cities in the US have Chinese communities, and not just Chinese from Taiwan or Singapore, but from the mainland as well. Some Kung fu schools (or taiqi) would be a place to start to meet some people (and good for you health too!). You'd want to go to one with members from the Chinese communities.

One last thing, don't limit yourself to Buddhist studies. Read literature, both Western and Chinese (and Asian, too). Learn history. Being cultured and educated, and being able to articulate yourself well, goes a long way in China.

Then let your life unfold and see what happens. We rarely have dreams that are impossible to realize in some way. Just be careful not to reify your dream as that can become the obstacle to achieving it.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby mikenz66 » Sat Oct 19, 2013 6:15 am

Uan makes some interesting points. All kinds of things are possible in China. I met a couple of westerners at a Goenka meditation retreat in Hong Kong in 2007 who had been living somewhere in southern China for a couple of years. They were studying Tai Chi and Tao, supporting themselves by teaching English. They came to Hong Kong every so often to renew their visas.

Being a monastic would be a lot more difficult than what they were doing, and I don't imagine that it is practical right now. But China is changing rapidly...

:anjali:
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Alfredo » Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:03 am

Uan has good ideas.

You should understand that in order to live in China, you will need a visa. The Chinese embassy...

http://www.china-embassy.org/eng/visas/ ... 071018.htm

...lists a variety of visas, from C to Z, on grounds ranging from tourism (L) to work (Z) to joining family (Q2 or S1). You'll probably notice D, which is for permanent residents, but it's not going to be that easy. Realistically, at 18 years old your best bet is a study visa, e.g. for attending a Chinese university (or perhaps kung-fu training). You are unlikely to be offered work from overseas (so you can get a visa) without a university education.

And then you will need money. How much have you got? If the answer is "not much," then you will need to work and save for awhile, and/or settle for living in Taiwan instead of China. Are you aware that Taiwan's culture is basically Chinese? There's a reason why everybody keeps mentioning it. If you are dead-set on going to China and not Taiwan, then do you know what part of China you are aiming for?

Unless the political system changes in the future, you won't be able to ordain as a monk in China. That's against the rules. Why? Because the government likes to build walls between Chinese religion and foreigners, who are seen as threats. You can ordain overseas (in the USA, or Taiwan, or wherever) and then go to China as a monk, but this will not make you part of any monastery in China.

In order to function well as a monk, you should learn Chinese well, study Buddhism, and take some time to get used to monastic life. This can be done from the USA or Taiwan, among other places. Are you aware of this place?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_the_West

Since it is so expensive, you may prefer one of its sister schools--two of which are located in Taiwan. (And there are others run by different Buddhist groups.)
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby tigerh98 » Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:05 pm

Can i get a permanent visa to live in china for ever?i like chinas culture language thats why and buddhism in china seems original to me cuz they got tibetan buddhism and han buddhism and mahayana and therevada and its the most powwerful country in asia and 2nd in the world its next to nepal and tibet and india well tibet is part of china how can taiwan be better beutiful than china?ps:check out my youtube:tigerh98 ull learn more about me
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby JKhedrup » Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:09 pm

I don't think "living forever in China" is that realistic for most Westerners. I wish I could live forever in India- I realized some time ago that is never going to happen.

But if your wish is really based on a sincere interest in traditional Chinese Buddhism, serious monastic discipline, and affinity for the Chinese language and culture, why not do it right in America, at the City of Ten Thousand Buddhas? In many ways, what they offer is far more "authentic" than much of what is available in the modern Chinese state anyways. Check them out.

This is not an empty recommendation- I spent 5 months in their monastery and was extremely impressed. I don't know anywhere in the Western world where such serious and rigorous Mahayana monastic life is available. It is truly a unique community. If it were not for my affinity with the Tibetan language and recommendation of one of my teachers to do the translator training course, I easily could have spent several years at the City of Ten Thousand Buddhas.

I would argue also, that although in many was the discipline is more strict than at, say, a modern Taiwanese monastery, they are also a more exposed to Western culture and willing to allow for Western eccentricities.

Plus-Visa wise, it'll be far easier.

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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby JKhedrup » Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:27 pm

Recent full ordination ceremony at the City of Ten Thousand Buddhas:

http://www.cttbchinese.org/update/index ... hives/4801
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby uan » Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:56 pm

tigerh98 wrote:Can i get a permanent visa to live in china for ever?i like chinas culture language thats why and buddhism in china seems original to me cuz they got tibetan buddhism and han buddhism and mahayana and therevada and its the most powwerful country in asia and 2nd in the world its next to nepal and tibet and india well tibet is part of china how can taiwan be better beutiful than china?ps:check out my youtube:tigerh98 ull learn more about me


Tiger-you still have a couple of years to go before you're 18. The reality is that an 18 year old is not going to get a permanent visa to live in China.

Since you're on Youtube, I'd recommend you subscribe to Serpentza who lives and works in China and posts extensively on all aspects of living in China, including jobs for foreigners and the visa process he goes through. Here's one of his videos on visas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHXY2a2ye68

I'm totally down with you wanting to pursue your Buddhist studies, and even becoming a monk, in China. Not all places are the same, nor do people experience the same place in the same way. For instance, I have a massive affinity for Wutaishan (one of the 4 Holy Mountains in China), but Putuoshan (another one of the 4 mountains) left me cold. It's clear at this point in time you have a connection with China and that's good. There are some amazing monks and temples in China.

However, I would recommend that you don't put the cart before the horse. By this I mean, it's not all about getting a permanent visa in China at this point in time. That's a bridge you will eventually need to cross down in the future. I believe one of the other posters asked if you had the money to even buy an airplane ticket to China and spend time there. That bridge is still a few years away for you - will you be able to cross that bridge?

Here's the thing, are you willing to really work towards your goals regardless of set backs, or the difficulty of the journey? It may be you need to go to China on a tourist visa. Then you may need to do that again and again. Then something else may come up. Etc. Foreigners getting permanent visas to live in China are rare. But it doesn't mean you can't find a way to live for years in China (ala Serpentza). My wife is Chinese and I got married in China and it was a process where they kept throwing road blocks and obstacles in our way. What helped was guanxi/connections that forced the process to move forward. And that was just to get married. Even to get my wife over to the US, getting a permanent visa, had lots of obstacles and requires a lot of patience (and a ton of paperwork).

Not a criticism, but to help you set out on your goal, you should work to improve your writing and language skills when posting here. We all make some typos and don't proof-read our work as well as we should (I know I don't), but it will go a long way to getting the people who will really matter in making your aspirations a reality behind you.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby uan » Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:09 pm

JKhedrup wrote:Recent full ordination ceremony at the City of Ten Thousand Buddhas:

http://www.cttbchinese.org/update/index ... hives/4801


that's pretty cool.
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby Qing Tian » Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:42 pm

uan wrote:
My wife is Chinese and I got married in China and it was a process where they kept throwing road blocks and obstacles in our way. What helped was guanxi/connections that forced the process to move forward. And that was just to get married. Even to get my wife over to the US, getting a permanent visa, had lots of obstacles and requires a lot of patience (and a ton of paperwork).


Good point. I am in the same position and we will - at some near future date - get married in China. However, I have never had any problems getting visas to go and live there - often for months at a time. I have found that one of the best, and potentially cheapest, ways to grease the wheels is to obtain a letter of invitation from a PRC citizen (my partner's family always do this for me). So, cultivating a friendship there can be exceptionally useful although it takes time and effort to do so.

Frankly speaking I think the American system for immigration far outstrips to PRC for sheer obtuseness, inanity and volume of pointless paperwork... but then I am not American and when I travel to the PRC I think there are some unspoken biases at work regarding this.

@tigerh98, you are young. Take some time now to plan properly and prepare thoroughly before committing to a decision. People who merely turn up in the PRC for the first time expecting whatever are often the quickest to leave. The environment is just so alien to Westerners (though that is changing). Also, despite someone saying that very few Westerners get permanent residency, I think this might be largely due to not many Westerners actually applying in the first place.

Side note: whoever wrote Taiqi needs a good educational slap. It's Tai ji. Qi and Ji are two different terms, unrelated. :smile:
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby tigerh98 » Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:57 pm

I know alot about china and im 100% that if i was to go to china tommorow i would survive even tho i dont know chinese -_- u guys saying like its hard to get a permanent visa to stay in china well i know im young but i know a lot stuff thar i learned in my home alone i have a paper that has 13 temples that are like the best ones in the usa but i just have that incase i cant stay in another country to become a monk but thats not my goal my goal is to go to china become a monk i know it sounds like a fast dicision but i believe theres a problem in samsara and really be in a good temple so my principle goal can be achieved reaching nirvana
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby JKhedrup » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:04 pm

im 100% that if i was to go to china tommorow i would survive even tho i dont know chinese


How can you be sure of such a thing without ever having visited China?
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
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Re: Becomeing a buddhist monk in china

Postby uan » Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:26 pm

Qing Tian wrote:Side note: whoever wrote Taiqi needs a good educational slap. It's Tai ji. Qi and Ji are two different terms, unrelated. :smile:



Lol - I wrote it. I actually wrote it as Taiji from how I pronounce it, then second guessed myself. I actually did a quick Google search and many of the descriptions on the first result page showed it as "qi" so I went with it. After you pointed it out, I went back and actually clicked on the links - it was "ji". Doh! (I don't know why the Anglicized spelling is Tai "chi" which is a mispronunciation of the word.)
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