Buddhist Geeks 2012 Conference

[plwk]

[Josef]

I wouldnt let any of those guys teach me how to make a pb & j let alone how to practice Dharma.

[Thug4lyfe]

[Mr. G]

I wouldnt let any of those guys teach me how to make a pb & j let alone how to practice Dharma.

This ^

[Kyosan]

I think this thread should be in the "Dharma-free-for-all" section because it could easily turn into an argument.
So far in this thread, no-one seems to like these folks. You have to do better than just badmouthing them. What's the problem with what these folks are saying or doing?

[Dechen Norbu]

mod cap off.....

...mod cap on.

[Chaz]

I think this thread should be in the "Dharma-free-for-all" section because it could easily turn into an argument.
So far in this thread, no-one seems to like these folks. You have to do better than just badmouthing them. What's the problem with what these folks are saying or doing?

I'll second that.

Plus, the 2012 Conference will be in Boulder!!! I might have to keep my calendar clear that weekend and take in at least some of it. The apres-conference stuff in the local bars, bistros and coffee shops will be VERY interesting. Boulder is the perfect town for this conference.

As far as the guests lecturing me on practice goes, I hang out on this board, don't I? I'd probably get more out of one hour with Jack Kornfield or Shinzen Young than a week hanging out, here!

[Mr. G]

I think this thread should be in the "Dharma-free-for-all" section because it could easily turn into an argument.
So far in this thread, no-one seems to like these folks. You have to do better than just badmouthing them. What's the problem with what these folks are saying or doing?

Their podcasts consist of interviews with the likes of Adyashanti, Andrew Cohen, etc. 90% of their interviews are with people like this. They should call themselves Neo-Eastern Religion Geeks.

[Kyosan]

I'm not familiar with Adyashanti and Andrew Cohen. Why don't you like them?

[Mr. G]

I'm not familiar with Adyashanti and Andrew Cohen. Why don't you like them?

I'm personally just not in to New Age teachings.

[Kyosan]

The problem with the term "new age" is that it can mean so many different things:

American Heritage Cultural Dictionary
New Age definition

A general term covering a wide variety of alternative spiritual and philosophical movements and beliefs. Arising mainly during the 1980s, New Age teachings range from the efficacy of crystals, to a belief in reincarnation, to the advocacy of holistic and other approaches to personal health and global ecology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Age
Widespread usage of the term New Age began in the mid-1970s (reflected in the title of monthly periodical New Age Journal) and probably influenced several thousand small metaphysical book- and gift-stores that increasingly defined themselves as "New Age bookstores."[28][29] As a result of the large-scale activities surrounding the Harmonic Convergence in 1987, the American mass-media further popularised the term as a label for the alternative spiritual subculture, including practices such as meditation, channeling, crystal healing, astral projection, psychic experience, holistic health, simple living, and environmentalism; or belief in phenomena such as Earth mysteries, ancient astronauts, extraterrestrial life, unidentified flying objects, crop circles, and reincarnation.

I don't know much about these "Buddhist Geeks", but doubt that they, as a group, believe in all these things. I'm sure they do believe in meditation and many of them believe in reincarnation. I suppose, in some peoples eyes that would make them New Agers. I watched the clip and what they were saying sounded reasonable to me.

I am asking again and please be specific. I am asking this question of anyone who doesn't like the "Buddhist Geeks". Why don't you like them? What is wrong with what these people say or do? Do you see anything you don't like in the clip?

[Mr. G]

I don't know much about these "Buddhist Geeks", but doubt that they, as a group, believe in all these things.

I didn't say they all did which is why I qualified my previous statement saying that 10% of their podcasts are with legitimate Dharma teachers. The other 90% percent though....

I'm sure they do believe in meditation and many of them believe in reincarnation. I suppose, in some peoples eyes that would make them New Agers.

A belief in reincarnation or advocating meditation isn't why I consider them new agers. I consider them Buddhist modernists who have a penchant for playing too much to the Advaita/Neo-Adviata/Pseudo-Buddhist crowd. This is why they should advertise themselves as "Neo-Eastern Religous Geeks" instead of falsely advertising themselves as "Buddhist" geeks.

I watched the clip and what they were saying sounded reasonable to me.

They have alot of podcasts on their sites with non-Buddhist teachers.

I am asking again and please be specific.[/quote]

Which I have just provided above.

[Chaz]

I don't know much about these "Buddhist Geeks", but doubt that they, as a group, believe in all these things.

I didn't say they all did which is why I qualified my previous statement saying that 10% of their podcasts are with legitimate Dharma teachers. The other 90% percent though....

I think you should be very specific.

I made a list of recognized Buddhist teachers that have been Vince Horn's guest at least once.

Richard Reoch, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, Sara Harding, Surya Das, Trudy Goodman, Stephen Batchelor, Christopher Titmuss, Diane Hamilton, Bernie Glassman, Sumi Loundon Kim, Hokai Sobol, Richard Brown, James Zito, Kenneth Folk, Jiun Foster, Grace Schireson Genpo Merzel Roshi, Rick Hanson, Vincent Horn, Judith Simmer-Brown, Rodney Smith, Kenneth Cohen, Jaimal Yogis, Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, Erik Curren, Danny Fisher, Norman Fischer, Brad Warner, Gaylon Ferguson, Tami Simon, Susan Blackmore, Daniel Ingram, Diana Winston, Richard Shankman, Gerry Shishin Wick, Joseph Goldstein, Reginald Ray, Jun Po Denis Kelly, Jeffrey Hopkins, Ven. Robina Courtin, Nova Spivack, B. Alan Wallace, Melvin McLeod, Stuart Lachs, Susan Piver, John Daido Loori, Diane Hamilton, Wes Nisker, Noah Levine, Thubten Chodron, Sharon Salzberg, Ethan Nichtern, Robert Spellman, John Travis, Annie McQuade, Fleet Maull, and Phil Stanley.

I save you the time. There are 57 names there.

Each one of these people has been a guest for at least 2 episodes. Some have been on BG six times or more Each one is a Buddhist of one type or another. Taken together they represent an interesting cross-section of Buddhism in the US today. We have heavy hitters such as Dzogchen Ponlop, Yongyey Mingur, Richard Reoch, John Daido Loori and Surya Das. Then you have lesser known but no less important teachers such as Judy Simmer-Brown, Sarah Harding, Thubten Chodron, Phil Stanley, Sharon Salzberg and Gaylon Ferguson. We have a few controversial figures such as Stephen Batchelor, Reggie Ray, Brad Warner and Noah Levine. The rest a pretty obscure, locally important Dharma and meditation teachers. The interviews are usually Dharma or practice related or include subject matter of particular interest to a young Buddhist audience.

Yeah, there's stuff in there bordering on New age, but 90%? You're gonna have to prove that Gordo. That, or take it back. Id' say the "New Age " content is far less than your 90%.

They have alot of podcasts on their sites with non-Buddhist teachers.

So? Buddhists have interests beyond Buddhism, don't they?

I am asking again and please be specific.

Which I have just provided above.

I don't find it specific at all. It's also largely unsupported assertion.

[Josef]

As far as the guests lecturing me on practice goes, I hang out on this board, don't I? I'd probably get more out of one hour with Jack Kornfield or Shinzen Young than a week hanging out, here!

Really?
I know I wouldnt. There are a number of people who post on these boards that I consider far better sources than any of the folks at that conference.
There is a lot of fame chasing with the dharma as the chariot going on with some of those folks if you ask me.
One of them in particular who I wont mention by name to avoid being too mean is completely incompetent when it comes to Buddhism but is using his connections to get published, speaking gigs etc.
Its gross.

[Josef]

I made a list of recognized Buddhist teachers that have been Vince Horn's guest at least once.

Richard Reoch, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, Sara Harding, Surya Das, Trudy Goodman, Stephen Batchelor, Christopher Titmuss, Diane Hamilton, Bernie Glassman, Sumi Loundon Kim, Hokai Sobol, Richard Brown, James Zito, Kenneth Folk, Jiun Foster, Grace Schireson Genpo Merzel Roshi, Rick Hanson, Vincent Horn, Judith Simmer-Brown, Rodney Smith, Kenneth Cohen, Jaimal Yogis, Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, Erik Curren, Danny Fisher, Norman Fischer, Brad Warner, Gaylon Ferguson, Tami Simon, Susan Blackmore, Daniel Ingram, Diana Winston, Richard Shankman, Gerry Shishin Wick, Joseph Goldstein, Reginald Ray, Jun Po Denis Kelly, Jeffrey Hopkins, Ven. Robina Courtin, Nova Spivack, B. Alan Wallace, Melvin McLeod, Stuart Lachs, Susan Piver, John Daido Loori, Diane Hamilton, Wes Nisker, Noah Levine, Thubten Chodron, Sharon Salzberg, Ethan Nichtern, Robert Spellman, John Travis, Annie McQuade, Fleet Maull, and Phil Stanley.

There are several people on that list that I wouldnt consider to be Buddhist teachers.
Many of them may be "recognized" as such by somebody but that doesnt seem to be too hard these days.

[Chaz]

I made a list of recognized Buddhist teachers that have been Vince Horn's guest at least once.

Richard Reoch, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, Sara Harding, Surya Das, Trudy Goodman, Stephen Batchelor, Christopher Titmuss, Diane Hamilton, Bernie Glassman, Sumi Loundon Kim, Hokai Sobol, Richard Brown, James Zito, Kenneth Folk, Jiun Foster, Grace Schireson Genpo Merzel Roshi, Rick Hanson, Vincent Horn, Judith Simmer-Brown, Rodney Smith, Kenneth Cohen, Jaimal Yogis, Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, Erik Curren, Danny Fisher, Norman Fischer, Brad Warner, Gaylon Ferguson, Tami Simon, Susan Blackmore, Daniel Ingram, Diana Winston, Richard Shankman, Gerry Shishin Wick, Joseph Goldstein, Reginald Ray, Jun Po Denis Kelly, Jeffrey Hopkins, Ven. Robina Courtin, Nova Spivack, B. Alan Wallace, Melvin McLeod, Stuart Lachs, Susan Piver, John Daido Loori, Diane Hamilton, Wes Nisker, Noah Levine, Thubten Chodron, Sharon Salzberg, Ethan Nichtern, Robert Spellman, John Travis, Annie McQuade, Fleet Maull, and Phil Stanley.

There are several people on that list that I wouldnt consider to be Buddhist teachers.

Really? Care to name them?

[Acchantika]

I made a list of recognized Buddhist teachers that have been Vince Horn's guest at least once.

Richard Reoch, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, Sara Harding, Surya Das, Trudy Goodman, Stephen Batchelor, Christopher Titmuss, Diane Hamilton, Bernie Glassman, Sumi Loundon Kim, Hokai Sobol, Richard Brown, James Zito, Kenneth Folk, Jiun Foster, Grace Schireson Genpo Merzel Roshi, Rick Hanson, Vincent Horn, Judith Simmer-Brown, Rodney Smith, Kenneth Cohen, Jaimal Yogis, Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, Erik Curren, Danny Fisher, Norman Fischer, Brad Warner, Gaylon Ferguson, Tami Simon, Susan Blackmore, Daniel Ingram, Diana Winston, Richard Shankman, Gerry Shishin Wick, Joseph Goldstein, Reginald Ray, Jun Po Denis Kelly, Jeffrey Hopkins, Ven. Robina Courtin, Nova Spivack, B. Alan Wallace, Melvin McLeod, Stuart Lachs, Susan Piver, John Daido Loori, Diane Hamilton, Wes Nisker, Noah Levine, Thubten Chodron, Sharon Salzberg, Ethan Nichtern, Robert Spellman, John Travis, Annie McQuade, Fleet Maull, and Phil Stanley.

There are several people on that list that I wouldnt consider to be Buddhist teachers.

Really? Care to name them?

One example might be Susan Blackmore; who is neither a Buddhist teacher nor, in fact, a Buddhist, by her own admission.

I think if people watch the video carefully they will see that most individuals are in fact labelled "meditation teachers" rather than "Buddhist teachers". There is a significant difference between the two, obviously. Also, it is advertised as a "conference", not a "teaching".

[Malcolm]

I made a list of recognized Buddhist teachers that have been Vince Horn's guest at least once.

Richard Reoch, Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, Sara Harding, Surya Das, Trudy Goodman, Stephen Batchelor, Christopher Titmuss, Diane Hamilton, Bernie Glassman, Sumi Loundon Kim, Hokai Sobol, Richard Brown, James Zito, Kenneth Folk, Jiun Foster, Grace Schireson Genpo Merzel Roshi, Rick Hanson, Vincent Horn, Judith Simmer-Brown, Rodney Smith, Kenneth Cohen, Jaimal Yogis, Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche, Erik Curren, Danny Fisher, Norman Fischer, Brad Warner, Gaylon Ferguson, Tami Simon, Susan Blackmore, Daniel Ingram, Diana Winston, Richard Shankman, Gerry Shishin Wick, Joseph Goldstein, Reginald Ray, Jun Po Denis Kelly, Jeffrey Hopkins, Ven. Robina Courtin, Nova Spivack, B. Alan Wallace, Melvin McLeod, Stuart Lachs, Susan Piver, John Daido Loori, Diane Hamilton, Wes Nisker, Noah Levine, Thubten Chodron, Sharon Salzberg, Ethan Nichtern, Robert Spellman, John Travis, Annie McQuade, Fleet Maull, and Phil Stanley.

There are several people on that list that I wouldnt consider to be Buddhist teachers.

Really? Care to name them?

Well, Nova Spivak, whom I happen to know personally since 1990, is an internet venture capitalist who happens to be a Buddhist, and so on -- but he is not a Buddhist teacher. Melvin Mcleod may have some role in Shambhala, but mainly he is an editor, the same with Susan Piver, etc.

N

[Chaz]

Well, Nova Spivak, whom I happen to know personally since 1990, is an internet venture capitalist who happens to be a Buddhist, and so on -- but he is not a Buddhist teacher. Melvin Mcleod may have some role in Shambhala, but mainly he is an editor, the same with Susan Piver, etc.

N

Thanx N, much appreciated, but with all due respect I was asking Nangwa.

But you are right. Some "Buddhists" on that list aren't "Buddhist teacher's" per se. By the same token they aren't New Age teachers either. However, by sharing whatever insights they may have, answering whatever questions VH puts to them, they are, in fact, teaching.

The point I'm trying to make (and seem to be failing miserably at) is that Gordo's proclamation of 90% is just wrong. Further if there are some new Agers, Adviatists and so on in there, so frikken what? I've found Vince Horns webcasts to be good, informative and ocaisionally even inspiring. Ok, so he isn't 100% Buddhism 24/7/365. Again, so what? I, personally have interests that aren't Buddhist per se. Vince's offerings fit my interests well, so I listen to his shows with some regularity, especially if it's someone I know about. If others don't like his offerings, that's fine. They don't have to listen and they don't have to come to Boulder this summer (they'll be missing my company and some excellent beers,but whatever.

But 90% New Age?

[Dechen Norbu]

So, are people forced to like "Buddhist Geeks podcasts"?
Some people do, some people don't. I personally don't like most of them pretty much by the reasons people have been pointing. Perhaps some of you do and I'm sure you have your own good reasons. Now, the % thing mr gordo used is probably a figure of speech more than anything. Should he have said 75,5%? Geez, every little detail seems the reason to start a discussion. I'll think I'll check the phase of the moon...