Dechen Norbu wrote:Some things never go old. It's like sex and rebirth threads. They are never dead... only sleeping!
mudra wrote:Dechen Norbu wrote:Some things never go old. It's like sex and rebirth threads. They are never dead... only sleeping!
you forgot the What is Buddha Nature, Renunciation, Je Tsongkhapa didn't know what he was talking about, Jesus was a Bodhisattva, Buddha is really God in Disguise, and Buddhists are really Hindus threads....
Kare wrote:It would be more correct to say that parts of the Tripitaka has been preserved in Tibet. Important texts from the Pali Canon, as for instance the Mahasatipatthanasutta, are not included in the Tibetan collections.
I posted it at 3am sorry. What I meant was that those unfamiliar with theravada will often label what they know as hinayana as theravada, when theravada does nothing like that. For example theravadins only try to enlighten themselves, which is from what they have been told is hinayana but is not the case in theravada. There are so many theravada teachers trying to get others enlightened.Dechen Norbu wrote:You lost me there, platypus...
Pema Rigdzin wrote:Deepbluehum,
The Tibetans - in accordance with the Mahayana sutras - classify Hinayana and Mahayana as they do for good reason. Hinayana refers to the motivation to practice the Dharma for one's own nirvana alone. True, such individuals practice compassion and enagage in beneficial actions for others, and they even teach the liberating Dharma. But their ultimate goal is to achieve a non-abiding nirvana, and so they both practice and teach methods that lead to non-abiding nirvana, a peaceful state in which one's sentient being-liberating career comes to a screeching halt. Practitioners with a Mahayana attitude, however, aspire not to rest in nirvana, but to continue in an ever-increasing capacity for as long as it takes, to help all beings attain Buddhahood; accordingly, the methods they practice enable them to avoid the solitary peace of nirvana and embark on a Bodhisattva career for lifetime after lifetime and then to attain Buddhahood and continue carrying out skillful liberating means indefinitely. Thus their motivation and methods are rightly characterized as the great vehicle. Also, both the merit and wisdom aspects of the Mahayana are greater, and therefore the merit and wisdom of an Arya Bodhisattva on the bhumis eventually come to surpass those of an Arhat.
Now, about this sutta you mentioned... I've never heard of any Shravakayana method that guarantees Arhatship in 7 days, but supposing you're correct and there is one, I'm not sure how you're conflating the attainment of Arhatshipt with the Bodhisattva bhumis, let alone Dzogchen. These are each vastly different levels of realization. To begin with, attaining Arhatship means that at death, one passes into non-abiding nirvana - basically it's lights out for innumerable kalpas, i.e. one's own peace alone. One would thereby be forsaking sentient beings for all that time rather than continuing on the bhumis toward Buddhahood, so this would be entirely undesirable for one with bodhicitta. Then, if we compare the methods taught in the Mahayana sutras, you're talking about three incalculable kalpas in order to attain the 11th bhumi, or Buddhahood. Finally, looking at Dzogchen, a truly diligent person can attain not only 11th bhumi Buddhahood, but 16th bhumi (or complete Buddhahood), in one lifetime. And less diligent ones will at the very least destroy all causes to be reborn in samsara against their will due to karma, i.e. they will at the very least be reborn in a natural nirmanakaya realm and quickly attain Buddhahood there. So you're definitely not being led around by the nose by your lamas as you suggested.
"Now, if anyone would develop these four frames of reference in this way for seven years, one of two fruits can be expected for him: either gnosis right here & now, or — if there be any remnant of clinging-sustenance — non-return.
"Let alone seven years. If anyone would develop these four frames of reference in this way for six years... five... four... three... two years... one year... seven months... six months... five... four... three... two months... one month... half a month, one of two fruits can be expected for him: either gnosis right here & now, or — if there be any remnant of clinging-sustenance — non-return.
"Let alone half a month. If anyone would develop these four frames of reference in this way for seven days, one of two fruits can be expected for him: either gnosis right here & now, or — if there be any remnant of clinging-sustenance — non-return.
"'This is the direct path for the purification of beings, for the overcoming of sorrow & lamentation, for the disappearance of pain & distress, for the attainment of the right method, & for the realization of Unbinding — in other words, the four frames of reference.' Thus was it said, and in reference to this was it said."
That is what the Blessed One said. Gratified, the monks delighted in the Blessed One's words.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
deepbluehum wrote:I have received all the highest of the high teachings on this planet, so I won't say who or when, because I'm criticizing. I also have samaya with daily commitments. Me and the dharmaphalas are doing a stare down at high noon. Hahaha. Shakyamuni was protected by the Naga king. I'll let him defend me. I travelled around the entire globe listening and practicing in retreat. Then one day I just took another look at so-called "hinayana." I said wait a minute. This satipatthana is a really high method, contemplating death and impermanence, the body, the three doors of dhamma. Add two bodhichittas and dedication. Who said you can't get buddhahood like this? Then that's free, no ticket. No donation. No reading. Save your money and your time, buy rice and do practice. But you know if it is not a restricted text, who is going to travel around the world to hear it? If it is not a secret committment who is going to practice it? Or is all the gorgeous beauty of the Vajrayana a kind of ploy to catch us "ostentatious" people by the nose?
deepbluehum wrote:I don't expect anyone to accept my reasonings as true. But we Westerns have been exposed to the East for many years now. It helps to sometimes take a step back and check if we are seeing the forest for the trees. Healthy skepticism is a good thing still isn't it?
deepbluehum wrote:Mudra, I understand your stance. But we cannot aptly scrutinize a practice before we receive it. And I feel the closed teachings are some what of a lure.
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