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Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept? - Page 8 - Dhamma Wheel

Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Buddhist ethical conduct including the Five Precepts (Pañcasikkhāpada), and Eightfold Ethical Conduct (Aṭṭhasīla).
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mikenz66
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby mikenz66 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:28 am


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Dhammanando
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Dhammanando » Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:27 am


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Hanzze
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Hanzze » Thu Jun 07, 2012 3:43 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Cittasanto
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Cittasanto » Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:05 am

well the problem here is that people are making conventional and spiritual precepts the same.
the first four precepts of the five precepts are worldly precepts, i.e. the world (society, law) deems them inappropriate, however what society deeps inappropriate changes over time, sexual misconduct, for example, as described in the suttas would be considered broken by many in modern times where in the texts it would not of been in all cases, such as poligamy; hiring a prostitute; courtesan...
the same is true here, as theft is a worldly precept, when something is similar (i.e. when the UN or other governmental agency) deams something tantamount to, or there is a prosecution due to the possibility of infringement (in this case) the precept is broken when the act is knowingly done, when applying the four great standards, (which do need applied at times to lay precepts also)


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

Maarten
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Maarten » Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:24 pm

I think the idea of intellectual ownership is ridiculous. Lets say I were to “own” every single musical note. Then I could ban others from using these notes and be the only one in the world with the right to compose music. To me that is crazy.
Ideas are also not unique, there are always others who came up with the same idea completely on their own. Why would they not deserve the same rights?

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Kim OHara
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Kim OHara » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:03 pm


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BubbaBuddhist
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby BubbaBuddhist » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:43 pm

Greetings my friends,

I wonder if anyone who has taken the side which supports illegal downloading has actually released a product of the fruits of their creative efforts. I have, as have many of my acquaintances. When you find one of your books or DVDs on a torrents site it causes a sick feeling. So much so I have many friends, very creative people, who have stopped production because they've said, "Why bother? The creeps will just pirate it and put it up on the Internet." So not only does this practice hurt the creator, it hurts the audience, as creators cease production in despair.

I think there is an attitude of entitlement, that many people feel they have a "right" to the fruits of other's creative efforts and talents, without paying, that information, services and damn near everything else should be given freely and without recompense. Fine. You give me something in return and I'll reciprocate; I love the barter system. But as old Heinlien loved to say, TANSTAAFL kiddies.

When I find my material on a torrents site I immediately contact the host with a DMCA takedown notice and have it removed. If they do not comply, my attorney gets involved. This is how strongly I, as a creator of original material, feel about this issue. As for the question of whether or not it takes money away from the creator, yes, it does. My sales go down when one of my products is torrented, and goes back up when I have the torrent removed. Unfortunately people, like water, seek their own level,and it's often the path of least resistance, so if they can get something they want for free, they will do so, and if they can't they'll pay for it. If it's a luxury item like music, movies or a book, they'll find a way to pay for it if they really want it. As someone pointed out, it ain't insulin, they don't need it to live. If you can't afford it don't get it. I wanted a piano but I didn't go out and steal one; I put money away in a savings account until I could buy it. The same principle applies here.

I'm about to publish a fiction series in e-book format with a website and extensive Internet marketing to promote it. I know there will be pirating even though the e-books will be reasonably priced at around $2.99 each, and the audio books at around $9.99. And I will be diligent at having the torrents removed, because I believe creativity and hard work should be rewarded, but I'm old-fashioned that way.

My two cents,

The Bubba
Author of Redneck Buddhism: or Will You Reincarnate as Your Own Cousin?

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Kim OHara
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Kim OHara » Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:35 am

:thumbsup:
Well said, BB!

:namaste:
Kim

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Hanzze
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:58 am

At a good level of observing "Not taking what is not given" download it self would be not easy, so there would be no doubt at all in regard of illegal download.

Believe in something that is called "right" just makes the work on deeds impossible.
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Cittasanto
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Cittasanto » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:28 am

agreed, well said BB


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

Buckwheat
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Buckwheat » Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:59 pm

kudos, BB :thumbsup:
Sotthī hontu nirantaraṃ - May you forever be well.

Maarten
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Maarten » Fri Sep 14, 2012 9:51 pm


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Kim OHara
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Kim OHara » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:47 pm


Maarten
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Maarten » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:49 pm

Imagine scientists invented a device that could copy food. Would it not be highly immoral of someone to copyright the food and then charge money for the copied food? If it was not for these copyright laws the hunger problems in the world would be solved and lives would be saved.
Imagine someone owning copyright on medicine they invented...
Imagine someone owning copyright on medical /psychological treatments they invented...
Imagine someone owning and selling the Dhamma...
All of these would cost lives.

Maarten
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Maarten » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:53 pm


matais
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby matais » Sat Sep 15, 2012 12:17 am


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Hanzze
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Hanzze » Sat Sep 15, 2012 1:23 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

Maarten
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Maarten » Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:21 pm


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Kim OHara
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Kim OHara » Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:40 pm


Buckwheat
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Re: Does illegal downloading violate the 2nd precept?

Postby Buckwheat » Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:27 am

Sotthī hontu nirantaraṃ - May you forever be well.


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