switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

No holds barred discussion on the Buddhadharma. Argue about rebirth, karma, commentarial interpretations etc. Be nice to each other.

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby futerko » Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:50 pm

KonchokZoepa wrote:because it is not focusing on an object in the higher states of practice. it is resting in emptiness or mind's nature. not on a object.


If you want to rest in emptiness then Theravada is preferable. If you want to rest in the nature of mind then Mahamudra/Dzogchen is preferable.
we cannot get rid of God because we still believe in grammar - Nietzsche
User avatar
futerko
 
Posts: 993
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:58 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby JKhedrup » Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:42 pm

http://rootinstitute.com/newsletter2013.pdf

On page 7 of the Root Institute newsletter, Ven. Antonio Satta, who ordained many years ago in the Gelug traditions, talks about the benefits of time spent in a Theravada country and the relevance of Vipassana for Vajrayana practitioners.
Last edited by JKhedrup on Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
-Sakya Pandita
JKhedrup
Former staff member
 
Posts: 1945
Joined: Wed May 30, 2012 8:28 am
Location: the Netherlands and India

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby KonchokZoepa » Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:55 pm

i believe its page seven but thanks :namaste:
KonchokZoepa
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby JKhedrup » Mon Nov 04, 2013 1:01 pm

My bad, page number corrected.

Ven. Antonio is a very popular teacher throughout the FPMT centres, it seems many of the students really appreciate the benefits of the Vipassana practice. It is also interesting how he manages to use a combination of Theravada and Mahayana methods successfully during the retreats.
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
-Sakya Pandita
JKhedrup
Former staff member
 
Posts: 1945
Joined: Wed May 30, 2012 8:28 am
Location: the Netherlands and India

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby Sherab Dorje » Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:21 pm

futerko wrote:If you want to rest in emptiness then Theravada is preferable. If you want to rest in the nature of mind then Mahamudra/Dzogchen is preferable.
The difference, in your experience, being?
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
User avatar
Sherab Dorje
Former staff member
 
Posts: 7899
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 9:27 pm
Location: Greece

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby dharmagoat » Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:36 pm

Sherab Dorje wrote:
futerko wrote:If you want to rest in emptiness then Theravada is preferable. If you want to rest in the nature of mind then Mahamudra/Dzogchen is preferable.
The difference, in your experience, being?

This helps convey the fact that ultimately there really is no difference between these two branches, just in the way such things are described.
User avatar
dharmagoat
 
Posts: 993
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2009 8:39 pm

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby futerko » Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:49 pm

Sherab Dorje wrote:
futerko wrote:If you want to rest in emptiness then Theravada is preferable. If you want to rest in the nature of mind then Mahamudra/Dzogchen is preferable.
The difference, in your experience, being?


Whether one takes long retreats into solitude to attain Samadhi first, prior to Vippashyana, or not.
we cannot get rid of God because we still believe in grammar - Nietzsche
User avatar
futerko
 
Posts: 993
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:58 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby KonchokZoepa » Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:40 am

YAYY, I got accepted in to Pa Auk Monastery for retreat in Mawlamyine, the head monastery. Anyhow i have now made other plans so i cant go there on january but maybe next summer :thinking: :woohoo: :meditate:
KonchokZoepa
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby tatpurusa » Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:03 am

dharmagoat wrote:
Sherab Dorje wrote:
futerko wrote:If you want to rest in emptiness then Theravada is preferable. If you want to rest in the nature of mind then Mahamudra/Dzogchen is preferable.
The difference, in your experience, being?

This helps convey the fact that ultimately there really is no difference between these two branches, just in the way such things are described.


This is by no means the opinion of living masters of Mahamudra and Dzogchen.
They regard the experience of nature of mind higher than just the experience of emptiness.
Theravadin monks would not agree with that though ...
tatpurusa
 
Posts: 171
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2009 1:17 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby dude » Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:57 pm

The Buddha wouldn't agree with the Theravadin monks. They embrace the provisional and reject the essential.
dude
 
Posts: 473
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:38 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby JKhedrup » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:14 pm

Konchok Zoepa,

I really look forward to hearing about your experiences at Pa Auk. It is a place I pray to have the chance to visit one day, as I have been greatly impressed but its practitioners.
A foolish man proclaims his qualifications,
A wise man keeps them secret within.
A straw floats on the surface of water,
But a precious gem placed upon it sinks to the depths
-Sakya Pandita
JKhedrup
Former staff member
 
Posts: 1945
Joined: Wed May 30, 2012 8:28 am
Location: the Netherlands and India

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby KonchokZoepa » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:22 pm

thats nice to hear about the practitioners. i will make sure you hear about my experience, be that the case i go there. currently its a 50% chance i will drive myself to go there next summer. i decided to start school so im doing that this winter and and spring and then maybe spend the summer there and then back to school, and then maybe back there :smile: we'll see. ill keep us update :smile:
KonchokZoepa
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby Malcolm » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:23 pm

dude wrote:The Buddha wouldn't agree with the Theravadin monks. They embrace the provisional and reject the essential.


Which Buddha? The Mahāyāna one?
http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://atikosha.org
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

" The one who teaches the benefits of peace,
he is said to be a ṛṣī; the others are the opposite of him."

-- Uttaratantra
Malcolm
 
Posts: 10187
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby KonchokZoepa » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:45 pm

dude wrote:The Buddha wouldn't agree with the Theravadin monks. They embrace the provisional and reject the essential.


brrrr. the buddha probably wouldnt agree with the vajrayana monks either, at least not anymore than the theravadan. theravadin monks uphold the original monastic style, just like it was in the buddhas day. and they study the pali canon which consist of the original works of the Buddha. now if you want to say that the pali canon is provisional and not essential, go ahead, but thats only your opinion, and your making a general judgement that even though the theravadans study the pali canon they reject the essentials of it. which is rude and ignorant.
KonchokZoepa
 
Posts: 1267
Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:50 pm

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby dude » Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:30 pm

Yes the Buddha of the Mahayana.
Of course that's only my opinion.
dude
 
Posts: 473
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:38 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby muni » Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:24 pm

Buddha of the Mahayana and............wait, can truth be in a right constructed dharma with which Buddha/Nature then agrees or disagrees?

Or the Buddha is not conditioned by various ideas about but we are?
muni
 
Posts: 2735
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:59 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby dude » Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:56 pm

muni wrote:Buddha of the Mahayana and............wait, can truth be in a right constructed dharma with which Buddha/Nature then agrees or disagrees?

Or the Buddha is not conditioned by various ideas about but we are?


Right you are indeed.
The Buddha's true intention is to lead all people to enlightenment, but his followers were incapable of believing that they could become Buddhas, so he taught the lesser vehicles of voice hearer, arahant and bodhisattva as a means to develop their capacities.

"People of small wisdom delight in a small doctrine,

unable to believe that they themselves could become buddhas.

Therefore we employ expedient means,

making distinctions and preaching various goals.

But though we preach the three vehicles,

we do it merely in order to teach the bodhisattvas.”
- Lotus Sutra
dude
 
Posts: 473
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:38 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby dude » Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:56 pm

muni wrote:Buddha of the Mahayana and............wait, can truth be in a right constructed dharma with which Buddha/Nature then agrees or disagrees?

Or the Buddha is not conditioned by various ideas about but we are?


Right you are indeed.
The Buddha's true intention is to lead all people to enlightenment, but his followers were incapable of believing that they could become Buddhas, so he taught the lesser vehicles of voice hearer, arahant and bodhisattva as a means to develop their capacities.

"People of small wisdom delight in a small doctrine,

unable to believe that they themselves could become buddhas.

Therefore we employ expedient means,

making distinctions and preaching various goals.

But though we preach the three vehicles,

we do it merely in order to teach the bodhisattvas.”
- Lotus Sutra
dude
 
Posts: 473
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:38 am

Re: switching from vajrayana to theravada for some time

Postby greentara » Sun Dec 01, 2013 1:59 am

dude, "People of small wisdom delight in a small doctrine"
You remind me of the christians, each bickering and thinking only they have understood the teachings of Jesus. The Catholics pour scorn on the Baptists and so on. Non really understanding the core teaching of the Sermon on the Mount.
In 'Ceylon' the scholar monks came to the fore. Walpola Rahula points out this was directly contrary to the original teachings of the Buddha, where the realization of nirvana was fundamental, not the mere study of the dharma. Scholarship became more important than spiritual practice and the ascetics wandered off into the forest.
The scholars reigned supreme; this was a radical departure of the way of life prescribed for the monks by the Buddha.
greentara
 
Posts: 891
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:03 am

Previous

Return to Open Dharma

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Alexa [Bot], JKhedrup, Johnny Dangerous, smcj and 15 guests

>